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> If any hetero identifying male wants to dispute them, I challenge him to spending a weekend in The Castro neighborhood of SF and write a completely truthful e

by jonahx 13y ago

> If any hetero identifying male wants to dispute them, I challenge him to spending a weekend in The Castro neighborhood of SF and write a completely truthful essay chronicling his comfort level. I used to live right near the Castro and spent lots of time there. I also lived in West Hollywood for years. I always felt completely comfortable in both places, and not because I am a paragon of not giving a shit. Sorry, but being looked at or hit on by a man is not, in itself, a traumatic experience. I know your post is probably motivated by empathy, but the above comment comes off as really weird and homophobic.

stcredzero 13y ago
Sorry, but being looked at or hit on by a man is not, in itself, a traumatic experience. You are reading something into what I wrote that I am not saying. Being looked at or hit on by people male or female that one isn't interested in isn't necessarily traumatic, but certainly the usual expectation is that it isn't completely devoid of discomfort. If that were true, then there would be no social cost to such activity. This isn't the case for most contexts. (And you know as well as I do that there do exist specific contexts -- certain times and places -- where that's what the expectations are, that one is there to be hit on.) I used to live right near the Castro and spent lots of time there. I also lived in West Hollywood for years. I always felt completely comfortable in both places, and not because I am a paragon of not giving a shit. And I will venture to guess that such environments are places you normally went and felt comfortable in -- people respected your boundaries in a way you found satisfactory, because you opted to be in a place where those were to your liking. For many men in North America, the social norms in many places in The Castro in SF or The Monstrose in Houston (where I lived for many years) are not the ones they are normally accustomed to. They will feel some discomfort. If they acknowledge the truth of that, then they will acknowledge the discomfort of some women in the workplace. EDIT: And it's those individuals in particular who have the most to gain from engaging in this gedankenexperiment. As for you, this would probably be preaching to the choir.

by jonahx 13y ago

stcredzero 13y ago

Sorry, but being looked at or hit on by a man is not, in itself, a traumatic experience. You are reading something into what I wrote that I am not saying. Being looked at or hit on by people male or female that one isn't interested in isn't necessarily traumatic, but certainly the usual expectation is that it isn't completely devoid of discomfort. If that were true, then there would be no social cost to such activity. This isn't the case for most contexts. (And you know as well as I do that there do exist specific contexts -- certain times and places -- where that's what the expectations are, that one is there to be hit on.) I used to live right near the Castro and spent lots of time there. I also lived in West Hollywood for years. I always felt completely comfortable in both places, and not because I am a paragon of not giving a shit. And I will venture to guess that such environments are places you normally went and felt comfortable in -- people respected your boundaries in a way you found satisfactory, because you opted to be in a place where those were to your liking. For many men in North America, the social norms in many places in The Castro in SF or The Monstrose in Houston (where I lived for many years) are not the ones they are normally accustomed to. They will feel some discomfort. If they acknowledge the truth of that, then they will acknowledge the discomfort of some women in the workplace. EDIT: And it's those individuals in particular who have the most to gain from engaging in this gedankenexperiment. As for you, this would probably be preaching to the choir.