4 ms·

I believe they hired HR and put new policies in place. Chances are this incident will make it a better place to work than before.

mtrimpe 12y ago
True. Chances are also that our collective estimate of how great a place it is to work at are now more accurate. That probably says more about the mythological status they had before than about the reality now, but it of course will have an impact on their ability to hire though. It also should have, and it's normal, and it's how startups turn into big-corps, and that's just the way things are. The sad truth about culture is that a sustainable culture will feel much more like your parents home than your college dorm; and that will never change... because it's a good thing.
- billiam 12y ago
  "The sad truth about culture is that a sustainable culture will feel much more like your parents home than your college dorm; and that will never change... because it's a good thing." That is the single best line I've read about work culture in software companies in......ever.
  - afarrell 12y ago
    This does depend on how dysfunctional your parents' marriage was. Though, I suppose a marriage in which both partners feel trapped is sustainably dysfunctional in that it won't end.
jowiar 12y ago
And this speaks, in many ways, to the purpose of HR. It's not good enough to say "We don't think we have a hostile work environment", or "Asking around seems to show that we don't have a hostile work environment". You need to be able to say: "Here's why there is no way we can have a hostile work environment, and how we're taking action to ensure we don't". Part of it is policies, part of it documentation of events, part of it is ensuring that employees feel they have a way to resolve situations. I read Github's statement as: "We don't really have any evidence of anything, so we're not going to say anything because we might get sued by one of the involved parties." That situation isn't a good one to be in (and letting an organization get into that situation is serious negligence on the part of leadership).
- krakensden 12y ago
  > You need to be able to say: "Here's why there is no way we can have a hostile work environment, and how we're taking action to ensure we don't". Part of it is policies, part of it documentation of events, part of it is ensuring that employees feel they have a way to resolve situations. I'm skeptical. The fact that there is a documented procedure isn't nothing, but it's not that much more than that. I suspect if I went back and counted, a strong plurality of the "I worked in a hostile male environment" accounts I've read occurred in companies with HR departments and explicit sexual harassment policies- GitHub was pretty unique. I've worked in ten-person companies with an HR person. What an HR department does is make sure management doesn't get sued. The culture of the company isn't something they can control by fiat.
- justizin 12y ago
  HR is a dangerous force like that, you bring it in to prevent discrimination, and before long it exists only to hold open the door and collect signatures for anyone who registers a complaint.

mtrimpe 12y ago

True. Chances are also that our collective estimate of how great a place it is to work at are now more accurate. That probably says more about the mythological status they had before than about the reality now, but it of course will have an impact on their ability to hire though. It also should have, and it's normal, and it's how startups turn into big-corps, and that's just the way things are. The sad truth about culture is that a sustainable culture will feel much more like your parents home than your college dorm; and that will never change... because it's a good thing.

billiam 12y ago
"The sad truth about culture is that a sustainable culture will feel much more like your parents home than your college dorm; and that will never change... because it's a good thing." That is the single best line I've read about work culture in software companies in......ever.
- afarrell 12y ago
  This does depend on how dysfunctional your parents' marriage was. Though, I suppose a marriage in which both partners feel trapped is sustainably dysfunctional in that it won't end.

jowiar 12y ago

And this speaks, in many ways, to the purpose of HR. It's not good enough to say "We don't think we have a hostile work environment", or "Asking around seems to show that we don't have a hostile work environment". You need to be able to say: "Here's why there is no way we can have a hostile work environment, and how we're taking action to ensure we don't". Part of it is policies, part of it documentation of events, part of it is ensuring that employees feel they have a way to resolve situations. I read Github's statement as: "We don't really have any evidence of anything, so we're not going to say anything because we might get sued by one of the involved parties." That situation isn't a good one to be in (and letting an organization get into that situation is serious negligence on the part of leadership).

krakensden 12y ago
> You need to be able to say: "Here's why there is no way we can have a hostile work environment, and how we're taking action to ensure we don't". Part of it is policies, part of it documentation of events, part of it is ensuring that employees feel they have a way to resolve situations. I'm skeptical. The fact that there is a documented procedure isn't nothing, but it's not that much more than that. I suspect if I went back and counted, a strong plurality of the "I worked in a hostile male environment" accounts I've read occurred in companies with HR departments and explicit sexual harassment policies- GitHub was pretty unique. I've worked in ten-person companies with an HR person. What an HR department does is make sure management doesn't get sued. The culture of the company isn't something they can control by fiat.
justizin 12y ago
HR is a dangerous force like that, you bring it in to prevent discrimination, and before long it exists only to hold open the door and collect signatures for anyone who registers a complaint.