5 ms·

Theresa Preston-Werner's response https://medium.com/p/2fe173c44215 https://medium.com/p/2fe173c44215

by mef 12y ago

throwaway1991 12y ago
Theresa is full of it. I have no idea what happened at Github but she's been telling people in New York she started Omakase because she's "angry with the tech industry." With that kind of attitude it's no surprise Github employees felt pressured into volunteering for her. She has admitted that she's not just someone excited about her new venture, she is beginning conversations with the idea that she knows what's best for the other person and that's working for her/contributing to her charity. Not to mention that it seems like the tech industry has done a lot for her family's life so it seems strange and ungrateful to respond with anger that other people in positions of less influence than her family has, are not doing enough for the world in some vague sense. Not to mention the massive hypocrisy that she is raising money from institutional investors as donors to cover operations costs for her non-profit which is ultimately a shakedown on salaried employees. There are things I agree with Theresa about, but asking the ultra-rich for money to support her venture to pressure regular people to give more to charity is nuts.
- marshray 12y ago
  That does sound like a little more than the boss bringing around the Girl Scout Cookies signup sheet.
deleted 12y ago
[deleted]
- tptacek 12y ago
  No, that's saying that Tom Preston-Werner was exonerated, and that a different problem surfaced during the investigation. It is not necessary for Horvath to have lied for that to be the conclusion reached. Misunderstandings happen.
  - parfe 12y ago
    >The investigation found no evidence to support the claims against Tom and his wife of sexual or gender-based harassment or retaliation, or of a sexist or hostile work environment. However, while there may have been no legal wrongdoing, the investigator did find evidence of mistakes and errors of judgment. Using the word "exonerated" outright ignores the conclusion of the report. The github hired investigator reported no evidence of legal wrong-doing. Then the company fired/accepted the resignation of Preston-Werner for his "other" mistakes. I think it's safe to say Github would not admit to legal wrong doing publicly as that just opens them up to legal liability. But to then say "no legal wrongdoing" translates into Preston-Werner being exonerated has to be some sort of joke.
    - tptacek 12y ago
      Your scare-quotes around "other" are deceptive, since those other mistakes aren't a mystery.
      - parfe 12y ago
        I apologize if I missed it, but what mistakes did Tom Preston-Werner or GitHub publicly admit to? I just re-skimmed his blog and the github press release and only see denials of very specific terms regarding illegal sexual harassment.
        voidlogic 12y ago
        https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7623440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7623440
        crashandburn4 12y ago
        So, just to clarify, you mean the mistake that he made was allowing Theresa to speak to employees of github and make them feel pressured to contribute to her start-up? or was there something else I'm missing?
voidlogic 12y ago
This is all conjecture, but this series of events got me thinking about what to learn from this. I have a feeling Ms. Horvath and Mrs. Preston-Werner completely believe their own interpretations of what happened. This is a good reminder of how subtle and ambiguous our and others views of the same reality is. In her post Theresa mentions having a blind spot for the obligations that github employees felt for helping her charity, but she didn't see it, she saw friends. I think this is a good lesson to us all about not only making clear HR polices, but also always giving intentional consideration to how those around us see what we say and do. A kind of intellectual empathy.
- js2 12y ago
  how subtle and ambiguous our and others views of the same reality is Rashomon.
  - neilk 12y ago
    Everyone thinks the message of that movie is "all truth is subjective", but it's not. It's more like "the stories we tell ourselves and others are distorted by our self-image and our interests". At the end, the movie even explicitly rejects the theory that truth is unobtainable, and that everyone is corrupt. In the movie at least, disinterested third parties who have good intentions can reveal the truth. You may believe in subjectivity, but Rashomon doesn't.
    - MarkPNeyer 12y ago
      i'm not sure where you're getting this. the parent referenced a movie, after posting a quote marveling at the different ways people interpret the same reality. grandparent post was talking about the need for intellectual empathy. i've seen that work wonders in my life. it's like this thread of comments shows the need for intellectual empathy in microcosm.
      - RodericDay 12y ago
        I agree with your parent that the reference gave the impression of having misunderstood the film It's like someone is raving about the military, and someone quotes appending Dulce et decorum est below. Not a big deal, but big enough to write a small comment making a correction, just in case.

Theresa Preston-Werner's response https://medium.com/p/2fe173c44215 https://medium.com/p/2fe173c44215

by mef 12y ago

Theresa Preston-Werner's response https://medium.com/p/2fe173c44215 https://medium.com/p/2fe173c44215

throwaway1991 12y ago

Theresa is full of it. I have no idea what happened at Github but she's been telling people in New York she started Omakase because she's "angry with the tech industry." With that kind of attitude it's no surprise Github employees felt pressured into volunteering for her. She has admitted that she's not just someone excited about her new venture, she is beginning conversations with the idea that she knows what's best for the other person and that's working for her/contributing to her charity. Not to mention that it seems like the tech industry has done a lot for her family's life so it seems strange and ungrateful to respond with anger that other people in positions of less influence than her family has, are not doing enough for the world in some vague sense. Not to mention the massive hypocrisy that she is raising money from institutional investors as donors to cover operations costs for her non-profit which is ultimately a shakedown on salaried employees. There are things I agree with Theresa about, but asking the ultra-rich for money to support her venture to pressure regular people to give more to charity is nuts.

marshray 12y ago
That does sound like a little more than the boss bringing around the Girl Scout Cookies signup sheet.

deleted 12y ago

[deleted]

tptacek 12y ago
No, that's saying that Tom Preston-Werner was exonerated, and that a different problem surfaced during the investigation. It is not necessary for Horvath to have lied for that to be the conclusion reached. Misunderstandings happen.
- parfe 12y ago
  >The investigation found no evidence to support the claims against Tom and his wife of sexual or gender-based harassment or retaliation, or of a sexist or hostile work environment. However, while there may have been no legal wrongdoing, the investigator did find evidence of mistakes and errors of judgment. Using the word "exonerated" outright ignores the conclusion of the report. The github hired investigator reported no evidence of legal wrong-doing. Then the company fired/accepted the resignation of Preston-Werner for his "other" mistakes. I think it's safe to say Github would not admit to legal wrong doing publicly as that just opens them up to legal liability. But to then say "no legal wrongdoing" translates into Preston-Werner being exonerated has to be some sort of joke.
  - tptacek 12y ago
    Your scare-quotes around "other" are deceptive, since those other mistakes aren't a mystery.
    - parfe 12y ago
      I apologize if I missed it, but what mistakes did Tom Preston-Werner or GitHub publicly admit to? I just re-skimmed his blog and the github press release and only see denials of very specific terms regarding illegal sexual harassment.
      - voidlogic 12y ago
        https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7623440 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7623440
        crashandburn4 12y ago
        So, just to clarify, you mean the mistake that he made was allowing Theresa to speak to employees of github and make them feel pressured to contribute to her start-up? or was there something else I'm missing?

voidlogic 12y ago

This is all conjecture, but this series of events got me thinking about what to learn from this. I have a feeling Ms. Horvath and Mrs. Preston-Werner completely believe their own interpretations of what happened. This is a good reminder of how subtle and ambiguous our and others views of the same reality is. In her post Theresa mentions having a blind spot for the obligations that github employees felt for helping her charity, but she didn't see it, she saw friends. I think this is a good lesson to us all about not only making clear HR polices, but also always giving intentional consideration to how those around us see what we say and do. A kind of intellectual empathy.

js2 12y ago
how subtle and ambiguous our and others views of the same reality is Rashomon.
- neilk 12y ago
  Everyone thinks the message of that movie is "all truth is subjective", but it's not. It's more like "the stories we tell ourselves and others are distorted by our self-image and our interests". At the end, the movie even explicitly rejects the theory that truth is unobtainable, and that everyone is corrupt. In the movie at least, disinterested third parties who have good intentions can reveal the truth. You may believe in subjectivity, but Rashomon doesn't.
  - MarkPNeyer 12y ago
    i'm not sure where you're getting this. the parent referenced a movie, after posting a quote marveling at the different ways people interpret the same reality. grandparent post was talking about the need for intellectual empathy. i've seen that work wonders in my life. it's like this thread of comments shows the need for intellectual empathy in microcosm.
    - RodericDay 12y ago
      I agree with your parent that the reference gave the impression of having misunderstood the film It's like someone is raving about the military, and someone quotes appending Dulce et decorum est below. Not a big deal, but big enough to write a small comment making a correction, just in case.