4 ms·

This doesn't just happen in large companies. I've experienced this kind of useless gatekeeping with 50-100 person "startups". I'm sometimes asked about tech hi

This doesn't just happen in large companies. I've experienced this kind of useless gatekeeping with 50-100 person "startups". I'm sometimes asked about tech hiring and I keep telling people that technical teams need to be responsible for technical recruiting. No one wants to hear that though.

wyclif 12y ago
Apparently, nobody on teams has time to invest in recruiting. Because meetings. Or something. Here's the reality: these companies can't hire. I know it and they know it. They can't hire because they're invested in cancerous HR bureaucracy. Think The Crimson Permanent Assurance, the opening scene in Monty Python's "The Meaning of Life." Turns out there's a reason why The Very Big Corporation of America can't move fast and hire the people they need. And a lot of smaller companies trying in vain to hire like this don't have any excuse to act like VBCA because they aren't big now and never will be. They can't hire because they won't pay market salaries, don't offer enough equity, and try to make up for it with a combination of pizza, Red Bull, foosball, and nerf guns. They can't hire because their office is a place that makes Initech (the company in Office Space) look appealing. They can't hire because they skimp on benefits. All this has been covered before, but VBCA refuses to learn anything new because they don't want to change the way they do things. http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000050.html http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000050.html
- Aloha 12y ago
  I got a job at a start up once - it lasted 3 days - I still dont understand what happened. I had been laid off from my job, decided to take a stab at relocating to the bay area, took me a couple weeks, landed a job at a storage startup - I was a contractor, but it was contract to hire - the interview was kinda odd - normal technical questions, then a very strange interview with the manager which mostly consisted of "when can you start?" I'd like to point out - this was not some fly-by-night sort of deal - they we're clearly not on a shoestring budget, well funded by major industry players, offering a unique solution, and it was the true startup environment - replete with: engineers who looked as if they rolled out of bed, and into work - friday night beer, free lunch, well stocked soda, nap and gaming rooms, and of course the obligatory fooseball table. My title was to be "Senior Technical Support Engineer" - on my first day I was handed an HP laptop - with nothing but Windows on it, and a manual for their product, which I read in about 2 hours (I read fast, and it was only about an inch/inch and a half thick) - my training consisted mostly of watching the guy next to me do calls - most of which have to do with license entitlement issues and anything beyond that or simple config issues, required come cli-fu to fix. The next day, was really just a repeat of the first - I still don't have an ID badge or a phone at my desk - so I keep watching and listening to these calls, I also took a note on hoe the majority of the office was dressed - pretty casual - Asking my peers about Putty and other apps, I asked, and was told I have local admin on the box, for office, go thru IT - anything else, just install yourself - so I then installed putty and winscp, and went thru the rigmarole to get office installed. The next day I showed up in toe shoes, jeans and a button up shirt - as I don't really have much in the way of dressy working clothes (plus they advertise not having a dress code on their website) - but my toe shoes are brown leather - so I figure it cant be that bad, I get a sneery look from the manager and an aside comment - later that day, I was called in - and told that this would be my last day - she said I spent the whole day on Facebook (at that time I didnt even have one), dressed unprofessionally and installed "advanced software" on my laptop - I of course protested, and indicated what I saw for dress - and then told her what I was told about tools - she told me I didn't need putty, that was too advanced. That was that - and of course the consulting house that sent me in basically looked at me as mud - I got fired on the third day; who gets fired on the third day? - eventually 2 other people had a similar experience and I was in good graces again. The moral of this is - its not enough to worry about HR - HR is one problem, you also need to make sure you have a sane way of onboarding people, no matter if your giant or not.
  - lazylizard 12y ago
    i don't quite get the 'advanced software' part..how can it be criticism? and what an odd example..like, what other ssh client should one use if one were on winodws...
    - Aloha 12y ago
      it was that I'd installed an SSH client at all. She told me I didn't need 'advanced tools like that' to do my job.
  - wyclif 12y ago
    Consider this—that post about hiring programmers by Joel Spolsky that I posted above is 14 years old. 14 years, and these companies still don't get it!

wyclif 12y ago

Apparently, nobody on teams has time to invest in recruiting. Because meetings. Or something. Here's the reality: these companies can't hire. I know it and they know it. They can't hire because they're invested in cancerous HR bureaucracy. Think The Crimson Permanent Assurance, the opening scene in Monty Python's "The Meaning of Life." Turns out there's a reason why The Very Big Corporation of America can't move fast and hire the people they need. And a lot of smaller companies trying in vain to hire like this don't have any excuse to act like VBCA because they aren't big now and never will be. They can't hire because they won't pay market salaries, don't offer enough equity, and try to make up for it with a combination of pizza, Red Bull, foosball, and nerf guns. They can't hire because their office is a place that makes Initech (the company in Office Space) look appealing. They can't hire because they skimp on benefits. All this has been covered before, but VBCA refuses to learn anything new because they don't want to change the way they do things. http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000050.html http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/fog0000000050.html

Aloha 12y ago
I got a job at a start up once - it lasted 3 days - I still dont understand what happened. I had been laid off from my job, decided to take a stab at relocating to the bay area, took me a couple weeks, landed a job at a storage startup - I was a contractor, but it was contract to hire - the interview was kinda odd - normal technical questions, then a very strange interview with the manager which mostly consisted of "when can you start?" I'd like to point out - this was not some fly-by-night sort of deal - they we're clearly not on a shoestring budget, well funded by major industry players, offering a unique solution, and it was the true startup environment - replete with: engineers who looked as if they rolled out of bed, and into work - friday night beer, free lunch, well stocked soda, nap and gaming rooms, and of course the obligatory fooseball table. My title was to be "Senior Technical Support Engineer" - on my first day I was handed an HP laptop - with nothing but Windows on it, and a manual for their product, which I read in about 2 hours (I read fast, and it was only about an inch/inch and a half thick) - my training consisted mostly of watching the guy next to me do calls - most of which have to do with license entitlement issues and anything beyond that or simple config issues, required come cli-fu to fix. The next day, was really just a repeat of the first - I still don't have an ID badge or a phone at my desk - so I keep watching and listening to these calls, I also took a note on hoe the majority of the office was dressed - pretty casual - Asking my peers about Putty and other apps, I asked, and was told I have local admin on the box, for office, go thru IT - anything else, just install yourself - so I then installed putty and winscp, and went thru the rigmarole to get office installed. The next day I showed up in toe shoes, jeans and a button up shirt - as I don't really have much in the way of dressy working clothes (plus they advertise not having a dress code on their website) - but my toe shoes are brown leather - so I figure it cant be that bad, I get a sneery look from the manager and an aside comment - later that day, I was called in - and told that this would be my last day - she said I spent the whole day on Facebook (at that time I didnt even have one), dressed unprofessionally and installed "advanced software" on my laptop - I of course protested, and indicated what I saw for dress - and then told her what I was told about tools - she told me I didn't need putty, that was too advanced. That was that - and of course the consulting house that sent me in basically looked at me as mud - I got fired on the third day; who gets fired on the third day? - eventually 2 other people had a similar experience and I was in good graces again. The moral of this is - its not enough to worry about HR - HR is one problem, you also need to make sure you have a sane way of onboarding people, no matter if your giant or not.
- lazylizard 12y ago
  i don't quite get the 'advanced software' part..how can it be criticism? and what an odd example..like, what other ssh client should one use if one were on winodws...
  - Aloha 12y ago
    it was that I'd installed an SSH client at all. She told me I didn't need 'advanced tools like that' to do my job.
- wyclif 12y ago
  Consider this—that post about hiring programmers by Joel Spolsky that I posted above is 14 years old. 14 years, and these companies still don't get it!