6 ms·

First and foremost, involving attorneys costs everyone a lot of time and money. Unless you want exactly that (maybe out of a desire to "punish" them), it's bett

by Hermel 13y ago

First and foremost, involving attorneys costs everyone a lot of time and money. Unless you want exactly that (maybe out of a desire to "punish" them), it's better to just leave.

Bluestrike2 13y ago
Any competent attorney will tell you that you should never litigate on principle (such as "punishing" them). If that's your only reason, many attorneys will choose not to take you on as a client right then and there. All the court can do is use money to attempt to redress your grievances, assuming you win. But that's not why you need an attorney right now. Even if you're never going to file suit, an attorney will help you navigate the waters and push for the best possible outcome in your situation. Maybe that's compensation for a clean exit, or simply putting an outright stop to the CTO's machinations. I don't know. Yes, they cost money. But this is already a legal matter. It became one the moment the CTO started to try and squeeze the OP out. Spending the money on an attorney now is simply an attempt to avoid losing more money later on down the road. Not talking to an attorney at this point is nothing short of willful ignorance. It won't stop the squeeze-out, nor will being able to say "I didn't bring in the lawyers!" somehow make things all better when you're out the door, up the creek, and without the stupid fucking paddle.
- Hermel 13y ago
  You are suggesting that the lawyer can help in two ways: 1. Negotiations 2. Understanding the legal situation Regarding the second point, the correct advice is not to sign contracts whose consequences you do not understand. Regarding the first point, engaging a lawyer will destroy whatever trust and mutual understanding is left in the relationship between the founders. This might be the US way of doing things. But before telling someone to hire a lawyer, you should make sure that the case in question is not taking place in a country where doing this is generally taken as a big offense.
  - ceejayoz 13y ago
    A non-lawyer is going to have a very hard time ensuring they understand the consequences of a contract if it's cleverly written to fuck them.
    - Hermel 13y ago
      Normally, when founding a company, there is trust among the founders and they do not try to fuck each other with maliciously written contracts.
      - ceejayoz 13y ago
        Trust is often misplaced, and there are plenty of people who seem nice initially while working to screw you.
        stretchwithme 13y ago
        When you write a contract designed to screw the other party, you run the risk of being discovered.
        ceejayoz 13y ago
        And when you're screwing someone who holds to the "no lawyers because you're supposed to trust your cofounders" approach that risk is generally greatly diminished.
        stretchwithme 13y ago
        That's true. Which is why you should trust...but verify.
  - Silhouette 13y ago
    Regarding the second point, the correct advice is not to sign contracts whose consequences you do not understand. Ideally, yes, but it sounds like that ship sailed already. Regarding the first point, engaging a lawyer will destroy whatever trust and mutual understanding is left in the relationship between the founders. You don't have to tell them you hired a lawyer at first, when you're just looking for some basic advice about what your situation really is. If it goes further and your lawyer is actively representing you when dealing with other people in a business context, and those other people take offence at this or it destroys trust, then you never really had a worthwhile relationship with them to begin with and you definitely want a lawyer in your corner.
orthecreedence 13y ago
Spoken like someone who's never been involved in a sticky legal situation. The money you save hiring a good lawyer almost always justifies the money spent, especially in a situation where you have forces mounted against you. Not only can they help you with "do this, don't do that" advice, they are very strategic in positioning and can offer incredible advice based on years of experience. Good lawyers generally see situations on both sides of the coin because they have clients on both sides of the coin, and hiring one can give you volumes of insight and perspective. Will it cost you $5K? Yes, but that $5K now might get you $8M two years from now...
zobzu 13y ago
Hey, I found the CTO ;-)
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]

by Hermel 13y ago

First and foremost, involving attorneys costs everyone a lot of time and money. Unless you want exactly that (maybe out of a desire to "punish" them), it's better to just leave.

Bluestrike2 13y ago

Any competent attorney will tell you that you should never litigate on principle (such as "punishing" them). If that's your only reason, many attorneys will choose not to take you on as a client right then and there. All the court can do is use money to attempt to redress your grievances, assuming you win. But that's not why you need an attorney right now. Even if you're never going to file suit, an attorney will help you navigate the waters and push for the best possible outcome in your situation. Maybe that's compensation for a clean exit, or simply putting an outright stop to the CTO's machinations. I don't know. Yes, they cost money. But this is already a legal matter. It became one the moment the CTO started to try and squeeze the OP out. Spending the money on an attorney now is simply an attempt to avoid losing more money later on down the road. Not talking to an attorney at this point is nothing short of willful ignorance. It won't stop the squeeze-out, nor will being able to say "I didn't bring in the lawyers!" somehow make things all better when you're out the door, up the creek, and without the stupid fucking paddle.

Hermel 13y ago
You are suggesting that the lawyer can help in two ways: 1. Negotiations 2. Understanding the legal situation Regarding the second point, the correct advice is not to sign contracts whose consequences you do not understand. Regarding the first point, engaging a lawyer will destroy whatever trust and mutual understanding is left in the relationship between the founders. This might be the US way of doing things. But before telling someone to hire a lawyer, you should make sure that the case in question is not taking place in a country where doing this is generally taken as a big offense.
- ceejayoz 13y ago
  A non-lawyer is going to have a very hard time ensuring they understand the consequences of a contract if it's cleverly written to fuck them.
  - Hermel 13y ago
    Normally, when founding a company, there is trust among the founders and they do not try to fuck each other with maliciously written contracts.
    - ceejayoz 13y ago
      Trust is often misplaced, and there are plenty of people who seem nice initially while working to screw you.
      - stretchwithme 13y ago
        When you write a contract designed to screw the other party, you run the risk of being discovered.
        ceejayoz 13y ago
        And when you're screwing someone who holds to the "no lawyers because you're supposed to trust your cofounders" approach that risk is generally greatly diminished.
        stretchwithme 13y ago
        That's true. Which is why you should trust...but verify.
- Silhouette 13y ago
  Regarding the second point, the correct advice is not to sign contracts whose consequences you do not understand. Ideally, yes, but it sounds like that ship sailed already. Regarding the first point, engaging a lawyer will destroy whatever trust and mutual understanding is left in the relationship between the founders. You don't have to tell them you hired a lawyer at first, when you're just looking for some basic advice about what your situation really is. If it goes further and your lawyer is actively representing you when dealing with other people in a business context, and those other people take offence at this or it destroys trust, then you never really had a worthwhile relationship with them to begin with and you definitely want a lawyer in your corner.

orthecreedence 13y ago

Spoken like someone who's never been involved in a sticky legal situation. The money you save hiring a good lawyer almost always justifies the money spent, especially in a situation where you have forces mounted against you. Not only can they help you with "do this, don't do that" advice, they are very strategic in positioning and can offer incredible advice based on years of experience. Good lawyers generally see situations on both sides of the coin because they have clients on both sides of the coin, and hiring one can give you volumes of insight and perspective. Will it cost you $5K? Yes, but that $5K now might get you $8M two years from now...

zobzu 13y ago

Hey, I found the CTO ;-)

deleted 13y ago
[deleted]