5 ms·

I couldn't agree more with this. Regardless of Eich's views, the controversy engendered by his appointment was obvious and foreseeable. The fact that he/Mozil

by zorpner 13y ago

I couldn't agree more with this. Regardless of Eich's views, the controversy engendered by his appointment was obvious and foreseeable. The fact that he/Mozilla didn't even seem to have a plan in place for the backlash indicates that he's unsuitable for a CEO role.

blisterpeanuts 13y ago
In hindsight, perhaps. But how exactly did it come out that he made that contribution? If someone hadn't uncovered it, would he have outed himself by publicly denigrating gay marriage? Seems highly unlikely. Many people have skeletons in the closet. While 20-somethings might idealistically believe that people ought to be perfect, especially a CEO, in reality there's simply no such thing. The political parties are painfully aware of the power of a very thorough background investigation to destroy a candidate's chances, regardless of his or her real qualifications. It has happened thousands of times, and I believe we have damaged our society as a result, by holding every candidate up to an impossibly high standard. The fact that Eich quietly resigned in the face of what amounts to a smear campaign is a sign of real leadership skills. He has class. He did what was best for Mozilla. A lesser individual might have made some lame apology to save his job, as demanded by his attackers. I respect that he did not do that, and I'd work for a man like Eich in a heartbeat. I just regret that so many have chosen to politicize Mozilla in this fashion, and I no longer have the slightest respect for the organization.
- zorpner 13y ago
  > If someone hadn't uncovered it, would he have outed himself by publicly denigrating gay marriage? That's what his contribution was. That's literally what he did. No one is stopping you from admiring Eich, and no one is stopping you from going and working for him. People who were upset by his publicly stated views chose to vocalize that, and to encourage others who felt similarly not to patronize the company he was heading. Is there any part of that process you'd like to prohibit? This is exactly how free speech is supposed to work -- say anything you like, and accept the consequences.
  - blisterpeanuts 13y ago
    What public statements did he make? Kindly share the link; I missed this somehow. It was my understanding that he did not make any public statements about his views on gay marriage but simply donated money to Prop 8, then someone was able to find this out because in California such a donation is public information.
    - zorpner 13y ago
      Are we really doing this? A public contribution to a specific cause is, of course, a statement. Now please, quote the dictionary definition of "statement" back at me to make this HN conversation complete.
- bzbarsky 13y ago
  I would ask you: how many is "so many"? I saw five Mozilla Foundation employees object to the appointment. Mozilla Corporation employees seemed generally supportive. What caused the real problems here were the media circus, the rampant lack of fact-checking in said circus, and okcupid's opportunistic publicity-grab.
  - blisterpeanuts 13y ago
    Well, I don't know but apparently it was enough people to tip the scales. Some commenters have asserted that a lot of Mozilla employees were upset by the Prop 8 thing, but I haven't seen any factual numbers, just hazy claims based on the myth that "of course everyone opposed Prop 8".
    - bzbarsky 13y ago
      > but apparently it was enough people to tip the scales Tip which scales? You seem to be under the misapprehension that there was serious internal pressure for Brendan to resign. There was not. The problem, of course, is convincing you of that. I can point you to https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/04/05/faq-on-ceo-resignation/ https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/04/05/faq-on-ceo-resignat... but of course you can decide to not believe that. I can also tell you that I'm a Mozilla employee (that's a clear matter of public record anyway) so I have some idea what was going on internally, but you don't have to believe me on that either... > a lot of Mozilla employees were upset by the Prop 8 thing A lot were. There's a difference between being upset and wanting Brendan to step down, though. So you get posts like http://subfictional.com/2014/03/24/on-brendan-eich-as-ceo-of-mozilla/ http://subfictional.com/2014/03/24/on-brendan-eich-as-ceo-of... and http://www.twobraids.com/2014/04/back-into-light.html http://www.twobraids.com/2014/04/back-into-light.html and http://incisive.nu/2014/thinking-about-mozilla/ http://incisive.nu/2014/thinking-about-mozilla/ which seem to me like the polar opposite of "politicizing Mozilla". > but I haven't seen any factual numbers Dare I say that this is because there aren't any? But "Employees support their new CEO in spite of disagreeing with him on some political issues" makes a much worse story than "Employees revolt against new CEO", so the press ran with the latter, facts be damned.
- DanBC 13y ago
  But if they'd had better responses planned maybe he wouldn't have needed to resign.

by zorpner 13y ago

blisterpeanuts 13y ago

In hindsight, perhaps. But how exactly did it come out that he made that contribution? If someone hadn't uncovered it, would he have outed himself by publicly denigrating gay marriage? Seems highly unlikely. Many people have skeletons in the closet. While 20-somethings might idealistically believe that people ought to be perfect, especially a CEO, in reality there's simply no such thing. The political parties are painfully aware of the power of a very thorough background investigation to destroy a candidate's chances, regardless of his or her real qualifications. It has happened thousands of times, and I believe we have damaged our society as a result, by holding every candidate up to an impossibly high standard. The fact that Eich quietly resigned in the face of what amounts to a smear campaign is a sign of real leadership skills. He has class. He did what was best for Mozilla. A lesser individual might have made some lame apology to save his job, as demanded by his attackers. I respect that he did not do that, and I'd work for a man like Eich in a heartbeat. I just regret that so many have chosen to politicize Mozilla in this fashion, and I no longer have the slightest respect for the organization.

zorpner 13y ago
> If someone hadn't uncovered it, would he have outed himself by publicly denigrating gay marriage? That's what his contribution was. That's literally what he did. No one is stopping you from admiring Eich, and no one is stopping you from going and working for him. People who were upset by his publicly stated views chose to vocalize that, and to encourage others who felt similarly not to patronize the company he was heading. Is there any part of that process you'd like to prohibit? This is exactly how free speech is supposed to work -- say anything you like, and accept the consequences.
- blisterpeanuts 13y ago
  What public statements did he make? Kindly share the link; I missed this somehow. It was my understanding that he did not make any public statements about his views on gay marriage but simply donated money to Prop 8, then someone was able to find this out because in California such a donation is public information.
  - zorpner 13y ago
    Are we really doing this? A public contribution to a specific cause is, of course, a statement. Now please, quote the dictionary definition of "statement" back at me to make this HN conversation complete.
bzbarsky 13y ago
I would ask you: how many is "so many"? I saw five Mozilla Foundation employees object to the appointment. Mozilla Corporation employees seemed generally supportive. What caused the real problems here were the media circus, the rampant lack of fact-checking in said circus, and okcupid's opportunistic publicity-grab.
- blisterpeanuts 13y ago
  Well, I don't know but apparently it was enough people to tip the scales. Some commenters have asserted that a lot of Mozilla employees were upset by the Prop 8 thing, but I haven't seen any factual numbers, just hazy claims based on the myth that "of course everyone opposed Prop 8".
  - bzbarsky 13y ago
    > but apparently it was enough people to tip the scales Tip which scales? You seem to be under the misapprehension that there was serious internal pressure for Brendan to resign. There was not. The problem, of course, is convincing you of that. I can point you to https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/04/05/faq-on-ceo-resignation/ https://blog.mozilla.org/blog/2014/04/05/faq-on-ceo-resignat... but of course you can decide to not believe that. I can also tell you that I'm a Mozilla employee (that's a clear matter of public record anyway) so I have some idea what was going on internally, but you don't have to believe me on that either... > a lot of Mozilla employees were upset by the Prop 8 thing A lot were. There's a difference between being upset and wanting Brendan to step down, though. So you get posts like http://subfictional.com/2014/03/24/on-brendan-eich-as-ceo-of-mozilla/ http://subfictional.com/2014/03/24/on-brendan-eich-as-ceo-of... and http://www.twobraids.com/2014/04/back-into-light.html http://www.twobraids.com/2014/04/back-into-light.html and http://incisive.nu/2014/thinking-about-mozilla/ http://incisive.nu/2014/thinking-about-mozilla/ which seem to me like the polar opposite of "politicizing Mozilla". > but I haven't seen any factual numbers Dare I say that this is because there aren't any? But "Employees support their new CEO in spite of disagreeing with him on some political issues" makes a much worse story than "Employees revolt against new CEO", so the press ran with the latter, facts be damned.
DanBC 13y ago
But if they'd had better responses planned maybe he wouldn't have needed to resign.