3 ms·

I haven't really seen the data to back up what you're saying and I base my comments only on the generalized fact that the automation didn't just drop out of the

by MWil 13y ago

I haven't really seen the data to back up what you're saying and I base my comments only on the generalized fact that the automation didn't just drop out of the sky - it took some labor to get it there, it takes some labor to maintain it as the current status quo, and there's almost certainly some labor already working to replace it. It's all part of a spectrum where specific jobs die but "jobs for people to have" more or less stay the same, if they don't actually increase.

ThomPete 13y ago
I am not sure what you mean. The US is one of best countries in the world for job creation and it is netto loosing jobs. Those that are still around outside the Wallstreet/Tech scene are becoming less and less valuable wallmart being a great example. Everything else is just a poor attempt to rationalize our way out of that reality.
- MWil 13y ago
  Maybe it's net losing jobs because we don't teach people to imagine how they might automate their own job and prepare for the worst case scenario (a drop in the value of the job you're currently trained for). We teach people to go to school and to get a job and to hold onto that job for as long as possible. That used to be playing it safe but it's playing it pretty not safe these days.
  - ThomPete 13y ago
    So what if that is the case? What's your point?
    - MWil 13y ago
      The point is the workers themselves didn't become less valuable because people != their job. If your job is in danger of becoming less valuable, have more skills ready to go, gain more skills while you work, gain more skills quickly when you are danger of losing work, gain more skills when you do lose work. Oh and by the way, ALL jobs are in danger of becoming less valuable. So this is really just a constant. If these opportunities don't exist, it's not the death of the job who is to blame. It's the system that failed to provide for opportunities when the job dies (as it is likely to do).
      - ThomPete 13y ago
        If you are unskilled worker and the only jobs that are possible getting is in the tech and financial industry, there is no possibility of getting new skills to get a job. You are simply just out of luck. You are hanging on to some unrealistic notion of it's just a matter of changing your skill-set. Many of these people can't.
        sokoloff 13y ago
        Tech and finance don't make food, serve food, clean, ensure sanitation, do landscaping, trash removal, construction, auto repair, transportation, make clothing, or 100 other things that people will continue to spend money on and where human labor will continue to be needed. I agree that a low-skilled worker is at a disadvantage, but assuming that a tech/finance slanted world offers no low-skilled jobs seems incorrect to me.
        ThomPete 13y ago
        Given that the tech world needs less and less people to run a successful company it also needs less and less people to serve it. Of course there are lowskilled jobs that is not the discussion. The discussion is whether there is enough.

by MWil 13y ago

ThomPete 13y ago

I am not sure what you mean. The US is one of best countries in the world for job creation and it is netto loosing jobs. Those that are still around outside the Wallstreet/Tech scene are becoming less and less valuable wallmart being a great example. Everything else is just a poor attempt to rationalize our way out of that reality.

MWil 13y ago
Maybe it's net losing jobs because we don't teach people to imagine how they might automate their own job and prepare for the worst case scenario (a drop in the value of the job you're currently trained for). We teach people to go to school and to get a job and to hold onto that job for as long as possible. That used to be playing it safe but it's playing it pretty not safe these days.
- ThomPete 13y ago
  So what if that is the case? What's your point?
  - MWil 13y ago
    The point is the workers themselves didn't become less valuable because people != their job. If your job is in danger of becoming less valuable, have more skills ready to go, gain more skills while you work, gain more skills quickly when you are danger of losing work, gain more skills when you do lose work. Oh and by the way, ALL jobs are in danger of becoming less valuable. So this is really just a constant. If these opportunities don't exist, it's not the death of the job who is to blame. It's the system that failed to provide for opportunities when the job dies (as it is likely to do).
    - ThomPete 13y ago
      If you are unskilled worker and the only jobs that are possible getting is in the tech and financial industry, there is no possibility of getting new skills to get a job. You are simply just out of luck. You are hanging on to some unrealistic notion of it's just a matter of changing your skill-set. Many of these people can't.
      - sokoloff 13y ago
        Tech and finance don't make food, serve food, clean, ensure sanitation, do landscaping, trash removal, construction, auto repair, transportation, make clothing, or 100 other things that people will continue to spend money on and where human labor will continue to be needed. I agree that a low-skilled worker is at a disadvantage, but assuming that a tech/finance slanted world offers no low-skilled jobs seems incorrect to me.
        ThomPete 13y ago
        Given that the tech world needs less and less people to run a successful company it also needs less and less people to serve it. Of course there are lowskilled jobs that is not the discussion. The discussion is whether there is enough.