3 ms·

I'm thinking more in terms of the person sitting in front of the computer rather than than the app. They are the ultimate 'client' who is served by the computer

by dejb 17y ago

I'm thinking more in terms of the person sitting in front of the computer rather than than the app. They are the ultimate 'client' who is served by the computer in front of them. That computer (thin client) is the client of the application server and so on down the line to the database and whatever other services (servers) are called. I can't really see a solid line of differentiation between an 'X server' and a browser. Would you call the browser an HTML/Javascript server?

blasdel 17y ago
No, because the browser initiates each connection.
- nailer 17y ago
  Just as a user running an X server initiates the clients to display on it.
  - ars 17y ago
    Actually no. The remote app server initiates clients to run on it. So the remote one is the client, and the local one is the server.
    - nailer 17y ago
      Actually no, you're confusing application serving (a term used in non X environments) with display serving (which X uses). X display servers (which we both agree are local) do not initiate clients to display on them, end users do this work - you can see this quite easily by initiating a client when you don't have an X display - the app will look for a $DISPLAY variable and attempt to connect to that display. The app is launched first by the user, and connects to the display server.
  - pohl 17y ago
    The distinction here is between starting a process and connecting to a listener to request services. Starting a process is not one of the two roles in the client/server relationship. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Client-server http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Client-server
    - nailer 17y ago
      Yes, but starting the application is done via a non-X means (typically SSH listening) before the app then seeks a listening display to connect to.
pohl 17y ago
You're using loose terminology that a system administrator might use, where "clients" and "servers" are machines. X Windows is using computer science jargon instead, where "client" and "server" are words that describe roles that two programs might play in a specific kind of relationship with each other.
- dejb 17y ago
  > You're using loose terminology that a system administrator might use, How dare you insinuate that I might be a system administrator. Or that system administrators really don't know much beyond their domain. I won't stand for it! I'm sure 'X windows' is technically a server in some the strictest sense. Technically I guess the client app issues a request for user input which is served by the X server. To extend that model the X server issues a sub-request to the user who fulfils that request. To me this seems to twist the terminology to the point where the user is just another service available to the program. It reflects a view of reality that does not appeal to ordinary end users and I believe this limited the success of X windows and unix/linux on the desktop.

by dejb 17y ago

blasdel 17y ago

No, because the browser initiates each connection.

nailer 17y ago
Just as a user running an X server initiates the clients to display on it.
- ars 17y ago
  Actually no. The remote app server initiates clients to run on it. So the remote one is the client, and the local one is the server.
  - nailer 17y ago
    Actually no, you're confusing application serving (a term used in non X environments) with display serving (which X uses). X display servers (which we both agree are local) do not initiate clients to display on them, end users do this work - you can see this quite easily by initiating a client when you don't have an X display - the app will look for a $DISPLAY variable and attempt to connect to that display. The app is launched first by the user, and connects to the display server.
- pohl 17y ago
  The distinction here is between starting a process and connecting to a listener to request services. Starting a process is not one of the two roles in the client/server relationship. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Client-server http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Client-server
  - nailer 17y ago
    Yes, but starting the application is done via a non-X means (typically SSH listening) before the app then seeks a listening display to connect to.

pohl 17y ago

You're using loose terminology that a system administrator might use, where "clients" and "servers" are machines. X Windows is using computer science jargon instead, where "client" and "server" are words that describe roles that two programs might play in a specific kind of relationship with each other.

dejb 17y ago
> You're using loose terminology that a system administrator might use, How dare you insinuate that I might be a system administrator. Or that system administrators really don't know much beyond their domain. I won't stand for it! I'm sure 'X windows' is technically a server in some the strictest sense. Technically I guess the client app issues a request for user input which is served by the X server. To extend that model the X server issues a sub-request to the user who fulfils that request. To me this seems to twist the terminology to the point where the user is just another service available to the program. It reflects a view of reality that does not appeal to ordinary end users and I believe this limited the success of X windows and unix/linux on the desktop.