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I would like to know from the IE team if there's a specific plan to fix the browser update issue, that is the fact that IE is by far the slower browser when it

I would like to know from the IE team if there's a specific plan to fix the browser update issue, that is the fact that IE is by far the slower browser when it comes to user upgrades. It's exciting to see features in IE1x+, but we all know that those will be a tiny fraction of users for a long time. I think that gaining consensus in developers' mindset goes through forcing updates like Chrome and Firefox do; don't care if it's monthly, quarterly or yearly, but users shouldn't even realize that an update was pushed to their machine. This model has shown that it works for browsers, and not only that, it has also proven to be the best model. Is there any actual actionable plan on this? Adding new features in IE15 is fine and good, but won't buy a dime in developer consensus, when we still waste time supporting 5-years-old IE browsers at any given time.

anton_gogolev 13y ago
I'd argue that IE is primarily used in corporate settings, when silently upgrading software is a big no-no. Everything has to be tested by the IT/IS department and rolled out in a controlled fashion.
- wil421 13y ago
  >I'd argue that IE is primarily used in corporate settings I wouldnt make that distinction. While its probably true that some corporate users are still stuck on XP. Most non techy people I know (which is almost everyone) just buy a new laptop open it up and start using IE. They will probably never upgrade unless the computer tells them or does it automatically.
- giovannibajo1 13y ago
  Last time I managed to find a study showing daily browser market share, I noticed that the drop for old IE versions during the weekend was significant but below 50%. So over half of those users are not corporate users. I don't like citing numbers without a source, but I couldn't find one in 5 minutes Googling. If somebody has a link that shows fairly recent daily IE usage share, we can double check my recall. I would also like to add that one technical solution for the "IE in enterprise" problem would be allowing parallel IE version installations. IE already allows to go into old version emulation mode, but it's not 100% faithful (I don't know the details). If it was 100% faithful, sysadmin could simply update IE to the latest version for normal browsing (or even let it auto-update, since I'm sure no sysadmin believe that he/she can QA IE better than MS for general Internet usage), and forcing compatibility (through GPO) for Intranet sites that are broken in newer version. But since it's not 100% faithful, the technical solution would be allowing to install an auto-updating IE in parallel to IE8, and then configure a policy to automatically switch to IE8 for Intranet sites (Chrome Enterprise does a similar thing; you can configure a GPO so that the user is automatically brought to IE when he/she browses to specific websites, e.g.: Intranet).
stupidcar 13y ago
Your info is out of date, as they have already fixed the browser update issue. Modern IE will automatically upgrade when new versions are released - you can see this by looking at the adoption rates for IE9 -> 10 -> 11. However, there are still a lot of users on IE8 and below, which did not have auto updating. As people gradually migrate away from these legacy versions and get onto the evergreen track, then the situation should improve until IE's overall upgrade rates match those of Firefox and Chrome.
- AshleysBrain 13y ago
  I don't see how this is fixed. According to StatCounter, IE shares are: IE8 6.7%, IE9 3.8%, IE10 4.0%, IE11 9.0%. IE10 is supposed to have an "install new versions automatically" option and yet still has close to half the share of IE11, and IE8+IE9 share is still greater than IE11 share.
  - Amezarak 13y ago
    I thought the "install new versions automatically" checkbox simply meant that new Internet Explorer updates were installed along with automatic Windows updates, where before they were optional. If so, aside from enterprise, there's (sadly)a significant fraction of home users that turn off automatic Windows updates because they regard them as a hassle.
dasmoth 13y ago
IE seems no worse than Safari in this respect. Maybe better actually -- those who can't update their OS for some reason remain stuck with Safari 6.1
- RyanMcGreal 13y ago
  Try installing IE9+ on Windows XP.
  - dasmoth 13y ago
    I agree this is a pain, and IMO a bad mistake by Microsoft. However, Windows XP was released in 2001, replaced (Vista) in 2007, reached end of mainstream support in 2009, and users have been warned it's going away for many, many years. OSX Mountain Lion was released in 2012, replaced just a few months ago -- but now doesn't seem to be that much better off in terms of receiving updates to its bundled browser than Windows XP is.
    - RyanMcGreal 13y ago
      Fair point. Microsoft has always been a lot better than Apple at protecting backwards compatibility. It's just a shame that they decided to use IE as a lever to push people toward newer Windows versions rather than doing what's best for the Web platform.
- giovannibajo1 13y ago
  I would have agreed up to the past September, when Mavericks was released for free. Some big leaps in IE updates are tied to Windows upgrades, which are not free for users. This has a direct reflect on Safari adoption. NetMarketShare gives these numbers for OSX adoption (which is the same of Safari version adoption): 10.9: 3.75% 10.6: 1.29% 10.8: 1.18% 10.7: 1.05% So roughly half of OSX users are already using the last Safari version (which was released only 7 months ago), which is absolutely different from the situation you have with IE version adoption. What would be the situation of IE version adoption, were Win7 a free upgrade for all WinXP/Vista users? I think we can agree that free operating system upgrade does have a measurable impact. Nonetheless, I agree with the general point that Safari now sits in the middle between IE and Firefox/Chrome, and that's why I have not mentioned it in my original post.

anton_gogolev 13y ago

I'd argue that IE is primarily used in corporate settings, when silently upgrading software is a big no-no. Everything has to be tested by the IT/IS department and rolled out in a controlled fashion.

wil421 13y ago
>I'd argue that IE is primarily used in corporate settings I wouldnt make that distinction. While its probably true that some corporate users are still stuck on XP. Most non techy people I know (which is almost everyone) just buy a new laptop open it up and start using IE. They will probably never upgrade unless the computer tells them or does it automatically.
giovannibajo1 13y ago
Last time I managed to find a study showing daily browser market share, I noticed that the drop for old IE versions during the weekend was significant but below 50%. So over half of those users are not corporate users. I don't like citing numbers without a source, but I couldn't find one in 5 minutes Googling. If somebody has a link that shows fairly recent daily IE usage share, we can double check my recall. I would also like to add that one technical solution for the "IE in enterprise" problem would be allowing parallel IE version installations. IE already allows to go into old version emulation mode, but it's not 100% faithful (I don't know the details). If it was 100% faithful, sysadmin could simply update IE to the latest version for normal browsing (or even let it auto-update, since I'm sure no sysadmin believe that he/she can QA IE better than MS for general Internet usage), and forcing compatibility (through GPO) for Intranet sites that are broken in newer version. But since it's not 100% faithful, the technical solution would be allowing to install an auto-updating IE in parallel to IE8, and then configure a policy to automatically switch to IE8 for Intranet sites (Chrome Enterprise does a similar thing; you can configure a GPO so that the user is automatically brought to IE when he/she browses to specific websites, e.g.: Intranet).

stupidcar 13y ago

Your info is out of date, as they have already fixed the browser update issue. Modern IE will automatically upgrade when new versions are released - you can see this by looking at the adoption rates for IE9 -> 10 -> 11. However, there are still a lot of users on IE8 and below, which did not have auto updating. As people gradually migrate away from these legacy versions and get onto the evergreen track, then the situation should improve until IE's overall upgrade rates match those of Firefox and Chrome.

AshleysBrain 13y ago
I don't see how this is fixed. According to StatCounter, IE shares are: IE8 6.7%, IE9 3.8%, IE10 4.0%, IE11 9.0%. IE10 is supposed to have an "install new versions automatically" option and yet still has close to half the share of IE11, and IE8+IE9 share is still greater than IE11 share.
- Amezarak 13y ago
  I thought the "install new versions automatically" checkbox simply meant that new Internet Explorer updates were installed along with automatic Windows updates, where before they were optional. If so, aside from enterprise, there's (sadly)a significant fraction of home users that turn off automatic Windows updates because they regard them as a hassle.

dasmoth 13y ago

IE seems no worse than Safari in this respect. Maybe better actually -- those who can't update their OS for some reason remain stuck with Safari 6.1

RyanMcGreal 13y ago
Try installing IE9+ on Windows XP.
- dasmoth 13y ago
  I agree this is a pain, and IMO a bad mistake by Microsoft. However, Windows XP was released in 2001, replaced (Vista) in 2007, reached end of mainstream support in 2009, and users have been warned it's going away for many, many years. OSX Mountain Lion was released in 2012, replaced just a few months ago -- but now doesn't seem to be that much better off in terms of receiving updates to its bundled browser than Windows XP is.
  - RyanMcGreal 13y ago
    Fair point. Microsoft has always been a lot better than Apple at protecting backwards compatibility. It's just a shame that they decided to use IE as a lever to push people toward newer Windows versions rather than doing what's best for the Web platform.
giovannibajo1 13y ago
I would have agreed up to the past September, when Mavericks was released for free. Some big leaps in IE updates are tied to Windows upgrades, which are not free for users. This has a direct reflect on Safari adoption. NetMarketShare gives these numbers for OSX adoption (which is the same of Safari version adoption): 10.9: 3.75% 10.6: 1.29% 10.8: 1.18% 10.7: 1.05% So roughly half of OSX users are already using the last Safari version (which was released only 7 months ago), which is absolutely different from the situation you have with IE version adoption. What would be the situation of IE version adoption, were Win7 a free upgrade for all WinXP/Vista users? I think we can agree that free operating system upgrade does have a measurable impact. Nonetheless, I agree with the general point that Safari now sits in the middle between IE and Firefox/Chrome, and that's why I have not mentioned it in my original post.