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Ok, point taken but equally, nobody is forced to develop for the iPhone. Develop for Android or Symbian. Ultimately, so many developers have succumbed to Appl

Ok, point taken but equally, nobody is forced to develop for the iPhone. Develop for Android or Symbian. Ultimately, so many developers have succumbed to Apples practices and they are responsible for giving Apple the power they have. This is still no reason for government involvement.

TomOfTTB 17y ago
I'm not necessarily agreeing or disagreeing with you but I'm curious about one thing: Are you against anti-discrimination laws like those that forbid people from not hiring a person based on skin color? I ask because those laws set a precedent of using Government intervention to make sure private industries treat people fairly. So if you are in favor of those laws you have to ask yourself if it's fair for some developers to be forced to develop on platforms with 30 million fewer customers.
- moe 17y ago
  laws like those that forbid people from not hiring a person based on skin color? ask yourself if it's fair for some developers to be forced to develop on platforms with 30 million fewer customers You didn't just seriously draw a line between those two statements, did you? Moreover please show me a developer who is forced to develop anything for any platform.
  - TomOfTTB 17y ago
    Yes, I did. I assume your objection is that racism isn't in the same league as what Apple is doing. I agree with you on that. But the government doesn't take a stance on racism. If Government was taking a stance on racism then they wouldn't allow racist literature to be distributed (as just one example). But they do allow that meaning racism isn't the issue. So the question at hand is fairness not racism. Which brings me back to my original point of "Should the government legislate whether private industries treat people fairly?"
    - moe 17y ago
      First off, please stop mixing labor law and human rights into this. That's so idiotic, it's not funny. Especially since there isn't even an employment relationship involved here. The app-store is a digital retail store. You are free to develop an iPhone app and offer it to them. They are free to reject it. Just like you are free to develop a better mousetrap and offer it to WalMart - and they are free to reject it. If you don't like their rules then don't develop an iPhone app. It's really as simple as that. And in case you are wondering what their rules are: They are explained in this big blob of text presented to you when you sign up. The one with the checkbox labeled "I understand and I agree" at the end.
      - jacquesm 17y ago
        You can not understand and agree to that which is not published, such as the official rulebook on which apps will make it through approval and those that do not. A transparent approval process would solve this instantly. And even Apple would benefit.
        moe 17y ago
        You can not understand and agree to that which is not published, such as the official rulebook on which apps will make it through approval and those that do not. You are mistaken, the official rulebook is published and it's right there in the blurb that you agree to during sign up. It's really short, too, as there is only one rule: Apple decides whether an app is accepted and they will neither tell you the criteria nor the reasons for a rejection. If you don't agree with that then you should not tick that checkbox. Easy, huh?
        jacquesm 17y ago
        So, you're arguing that there exists no other Apple internal rulebook than the arbitrary one that says 'apple decides' ? I find that hard to believe. I think a rulebook does exist, but that they avoid publishing it because they want to have the 'final say' even if somebody would play within the rules as specified in the book. And that makes sense, because it would open apple up to being sued for breach of contract, and that is exactly what this whole thing is about. A one-sided contract is no contract, consideration is to be given to both parties. Developing an application is an investment and you should be allowed to inspect the full terms of the contract under which you make your investment.

TomOfTTB 17y ago

I'm not necessarily agreeing or disagreeing with you but I'm curious about one thing: Are you against anti-discrimination laws like those that forbid people from not hiring a person based on skin color? I ask because those laws set a precedent of using Government intervention to make sure private industries treat people fairly. So if you are in favor of those laws you have to ask yourself if it's fair for some developers to be forced to develop on platforms with 30 million fewer customers.

moe 17y ago
laws like those that forbid people from not hiring a person based on skin color? ask yourself if it's fair for some developers to be forced to develop on platforms with 30 million fewer customers You didn't just seriously draw a line between those two statements, did you? Moreover please show me a developer who is forced to develop anything for any platform.
- TomOfTTB 17y ago
  Yes, I did. I assume your objection is that racism isn't in the same league as what Apple is doing. I agree with you on that. But the government doesn't take a stance on racism. If Government was taking a stance on racism then they wouldn't allow racist literature to be distributed (as just one example). But they do allow that meaning racism isn't the issue. So the question at hand is fairness not racism. Which brings me back to my original point of "Should the government legislate whether private industries treat people fairly?"
  - moe 17y ago
    First off, please stop mixing labor law and human rights into this. That's so idiotic, it's not funny. Especially since there isn't even an employment relationship involved here. The app-store is a digital retail store. You are free to develop an iPhone app and offer it to them. They are free to reject it. Just like you are free to develop a better mousetrap and offer it to WalMart - and they are free to reject it. If you don't like their rules then don't develop an iPhone app. It's really as simple as that. And in case you are wondering what their rules are: They are explained in this big blob of text presented to you when you sign up. The one with the checkbox labeled "I understand and I agree" at the end.
    - jacquesm 17y ago
      You can not understand and agree to that which is not published, such as the official rulebook on which apps will make it through approval and those that do not. A transparent approval process would solve this instantly. And even Apple would benefit.
      - moe 17y ago
        You can not understand and agree to that which is not published, such as the official rulebook on which apps will make it through approval and those that do not. You are mistaken, the official rulebook is published and it's right there in the blurb that you agree to during sign up. It's really short, too, as there is only one rule: Apple decides whether an app is accepted and they will neither tell you the criteria nor the reasons for a rejection. If you don't agree with that then you should not tick that checkbox. Easy, huh?
        jacquesm 17y ago
        So, you're arguing that there exists no other Apple internal rulebook than the arbitrary one that says 'apple decides' ? I find that hard to believe. I think a rulebook does exist, but that they avoid publishing it because they want to have the 'final say' even if somebody would play within the rules as specified in the book. And that makes sense, because it would open apple up to being sued for breach of contract, and that is exactly what this whole thing is about. A one-sided contract is no contract, consideration is to be given to both parties. Developing an application is an investment and you should be allowed to inspect the full terms of the contract under which you make your investment.