7 ms·

If you wait till the last day, you are probably willing to pay the fine.

emidln 13y ago
Fining people for failing to properly utilize a system that has never consistently worked is asinine. I imagine it won't be long after the first fines that they are challenged in court.
- danielweber 13y ago
  The administration has said that you can avoid the penalty if you sign up by April 15th and affirm that you couldn't use the website before March 31st.
  - ctdonath 13y ago
    There is no legal basis for that waiver. The administration has violated its own hard-won law in all kinds of ways trying to compensate for its failure to effectively implement it.
    - cgaudreau 13y ago
      The Administration actually does have legal authority to execute various parts of the law as they see fit. It does undermine credibility and set a bad future precedent, however.
- ctdonath 13y ago
  Fining people for failing to purchase a product is asinine. There's more precedent for requiring people to buy guns (and fining them if they don't; see Militia Act of 1792), but imagine the outrage if every able-bodied male 17-45 were required to buy an M16 and a case of ammo at their own cost (about $1000).
  - cgaudreau 13y ago
    Mandating people to buy health insurance and mandating people to buy weapons are two entirely different things.
    - ctdonath 13y ago
      Arming the militia (draftable population) in the interest of national defense does contribute positively to general health.
    - hga 13y ago
      Yeah, the former has no Constitutional or prior to the 20th Century, US historical basis, the latter has both. And for the Constitutional basis, I'm not referring to the 2nd Amendment, but per Article 1, Section 8: "The Congress shall have Power... To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions; To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
  - cujo 13y ago
    I get the feeling that if we were in real fear of the Brits trying to reclaim the land, and an untrained militia had a chance of being useful, this might go over just fine.
    - ctdonath 13y ago
      We do from time to time invoke a draft, forcing men to fight for their lives using tools they do not own and do not understand because they are prohibited from owning & practicing with them in peacetime. Skills with large expensive crew-served equipment is understandably hard to come by and justify a standing army, but small arms are affordable for most (if new models were legal, M16s would cost about $700) and would better prepare prospective draftees. When (not if) the next draft occurs, we face calling up & sending men who not only couldn't own & practice with internationally standard front-line soldier's weapons (M16 or AK47) but would be severely punished if they tried, and will rely totally on the government supplying what they could have brought. (Yes, some M16s et al are legal, but they're at least 28 years old, cost >20x what new retail price would be without prohibition, supply is extremely limited (hence the price increase), and are smothered in regulative "red tape".) Ya know, it's kinda like making healthy youth pay into a healthcare system that they likely won't benefit from for a long time to come (if ever; most will put more in than they'll get out): giving people access to products (physical or financial) designed to save their lives in short-notice crises is arguably so important as to be compulsory.
- tromobne8vb 13y ago
  There have been other ways to sign up. Via telephone, in person with a health advocate. The website is just one way.
  - ctdonath 13y ago
    By telephone just gets you someone who is using the website on your behalf. If website is down, by-phone is down too.
- furyg3 13y ago
  This is ridiculous reasoning... First off, healthcare.gov is not the only way to get health insurance. Secondly, it's not even the only way to find health insurance using the ACA (you could do this in person, or via telephone). Finally, a snowstorm is an excellent excuse for not jogging today, but a horrible excuse for never exercising. The fine is, what, $95? So you could request a fee reduction of $0.26 per day that the system was down this year.

Fining people for failing to properly utilize a system that has never consistently worked is asinine. I imagine it won't be long after the first fines that they are challenged in court.

danielweber 13y ago
The administration has said that you can avoid the penalty if you sign up by April 15th and affirm that you couldn't use the website before March 31st.
- ctdonath 13y ago
  There is no legal basis for that waiver. The administration has violated its own hard-won law in all kinds of ways trying to compensate for its failure to effectively implement it.
  - cgaudreau 13y ago
    The Administration actually does have legal authority to execute various parts of the law as they see fit. It does undermine credibility and set a bad future precedent, however.
ctdonath 13y ago
Fining people for failing to purchase a product is asinine. There's more precedent for requiring people to buy guns (and fining them if they don't; see Militia Act of 1792), but imagine the outrage if every able-bodied male 17-45 were required to buy an M16 and a case of ammo at their own cost (about $1000).
- cgaudreau 13y ago
  Mandating people to buy health insurance and mandating people to buy weapons are two entirely different things.
  - ctdonath 13y ago
    Arming the militia (draftable population) in the interest of national defense does contribute positively to general health.
  - hga 13y ago
    Yeah, the former has no Constitutional or prior to the 20th Century, US historical basis, the latter has both. And for the Constitutional basis, I'm not referring to the 2nd Amendment, but per Article 1, Section 8: "The Congress shall have Power... To provide for calling forth the Militia to execute the Laws of the Union, suppress Insurrections and repel Invasions; To provide for organizing, arming, and disciplining, the Militia, and for governing such Part of them as may be employed in the Service of the United States, reserving to the States respectively, the Appointment of the Officers, and the Authority of training the Militia according to the discipline prescribed by Congress;
- cujo 13y ago
  I get the feeling that if we were in real fear of the Brits trying to reclaim the land, and an untrained militia had a chance of being useful, this might go over just fine.
  - ctdonath 13y ago
    We do from time to time invoke a draft, forcing men to fight for their lives using tools they do not own and do not understand because they are prohibited from owning & practicing with them in peacetime. Skills with large expensive crew-served equipment is understandably hard to come by and justify a standing army, but small arms are affordable for most (if new models were legal, M16s would cost about $700) and would better prepare prospective draftees. When (not if) the next draft occurs, we face calling up & sending men who not only couldn't own & practice with internationally standard front-line soldier's weapons (M16 or AK47) but would be severely punished if they tried, and will rely totally on the government supplying what they could have brought. (Yes, some M16s et al are legal, but they're at least 28 years old, cost >20x what new retail price would be without prohibition, supply is extremely limited (hence the price increase), and are smothered in regulative "red tape".) Ya know, it's kinda like making healthy youth pay into a healthcare system that they likely won't benefit from for a long time to come (if ever; most will put more in than they'll get out): giving people access to products (physical or financial) designed to save their lives in short-notice crises is arguably so important as to be compulsory.
tromobne8vb 13y ago
There have been other ways to sign up. Via telephone, in person with a health advocate. The website is just one way.
- ctdonath 13y ago
  By telephone just gets you someone who is using the website on your behalf. If website is down, by-phone is down too.
furyg3 13y ago
This is ridiculous reasoning... First off, healthcare.gov is not the only way to get health insurance. Secondly, it's not even the only way to find health insurance using the ACA (you could do this in person, or via telephone). Finally, a snowstorm is an excellent excuse for not jogging today, but a horrible excuse for never exercising. The fine is, what, $95? So you could request a fee reduction of $0.26 per day that the system was down this year.