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Or.... you could practice moderation? Alcohol does not make you into a problem. You make yourself into a problem, and lump alcohol in with all the other things

Or.... you could practice moderation? Alcohol does not make you into a problem. You make yourself into a problem, and lump alcohol in with all the other things that you could blame it on. Grow up. Be accountable to yourself. Don't externalise blame.

seanhandley 13y ago
More thoughts here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7486096 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7486096
- chris_wot 13y ago
  That was quite unhelpful. And it should have been a comment.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
chrismonsanto 13y ago
how to fix every problem ever: 1) grow up 2) ??? 3) problem solved But seriously, people suffering from addiction or other "only in the mind" problems are told this all the time. We wish we could just "grow up" but for some reason we fail again and again. At this point, we have a choice: do we look at our history of past failings and realize that "grow up" is not an effective (or particularly actionable) strategy, or do we continue to beat this dead horse until it magically works?
icebraining 13y ago
How is OP externalizing blame? He's just identifying a problem he has. I'm downvoting your post for the completely unnecessary hostile language and unfair accusation. OP did nothing to warrant it.
new_guy123 13y ago
Accountability? Really? You haven't seen the problem first hand, have you? Alcoholics can be extremely depressed people, clearly aware of the fact that they are doing it to themselves. The question you have to ask is what if you cant control? In normal circumstances, all is good - you go home after a happy night. But what if you cant stop after 2 or 3 drinks, everyday. What if alcohol is your recourse when life hits you with a brick. Yes, I hear your speeches about self discipline etc., but they dont make sense anymore. If at all anything it makes you all the more sad. Its almost a coin flip. Some times, the right stimulus from loved ones comes in. Something more interesting captures your imagination. But may times, it doesn't. It feels like a cruel joke by the almighty or a nasty bug in the mind that takes you down the path of self destruction into oblivion. I think the OP is if you want to err, do it on the abstinence side.
Tyrannosaurs 13y ago
Out of interest (genuinely) do you also think people suffering from depression should just pull themselves together?
- klibertp 13y ago
  I downvoted GP assuming that indeed the GP would tell a depressed person to "stop externalising a blame" and "grow up". Which is actually quite a good advice for depressed people. Repeat it enough times and watch suicide rate grow rapidly... And depression rates declining! On a more serious note, people need to understand that the perceived "only in the mind" problems are actually illnesses which are much more deadly than many physiological ones. And that, by telling such things as "stop externalising a blame" (which depressed person doesn't do, anyway), you become partially responsible for the suicide if it happens. Yes, YOU GP are responsible, stop externalizing a blame and live with it. Or better yet, stop spouting nonsense.
  - Tyrannosaurs 13y ago
    Having suffered from very mild depression from time to time, my view on people suggesting that depression not be seen as an illness is that it's something of a red herring, at least in terms of practical solutions. If in some strange world someone decided that a broken leg wasn't a medical condition, it wouldn't change the impact if had on the person suffering from it. Someone still couldn't run it off just because it's not deemed a medical condition. Similarly people may view depression as an illness or not but that shouldn't make the believe that reclassifying it suddenly means that someone can just pull them self together. Speaking personally in the situation I was in you could certainly tell me that but the very best that would have happened is that I could have pretended to be OK for a bit, before relapsing worse than before (which happened several times, not because people told me to pull themselves together but because life just didn't give me the bandwidth to do anything else). Similarly telling an alcoholic that they're wrong about the nature of their problem does next to nothing to actually address it - it's just meta discussion.
drstrangevibes 13y ago
you sir , are a prick

seanhandley 13y ago

More thoughts here: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7486096 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7486096

chris_wot 13y ago
That was quite unhelpful. And it should have been a comment.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]

chrismonsanto 13y ago

how to fix every problem ever: 1) grow up 2) ??? 3) problem solved But seriously, people suffering from addiction or other "only in the mind" problems are told this all the time. We wish we could just "grow up" but for some reason we fail again and again. At this point, we have a choice: do we look at our history of past failings and realize that "grow up" is not an effective (or particularly actionable) strategy, or do we continue to beat this dead horse until it magically works?

icebraining 13y ago

How is OP externalizing blame? He's just identifying a problem he has. I'm downvoting your post for the completely unnecessary hostile language and unfair accusation. OP did nothing to warrant it.

new_guy123 13y ago

Accountability? Really? You haven't seen the problem first hand, have you? Alcoholics can be extremely depressed people, clearly aware of the fact that they are doing it to themselves. The question you have to ask is what if you cant control? In normal circumstances, all is good - you go home after a happy night. But what if you cant stop after 2 or 3 drinks, everyday. What if alcohol is your recourse when life hits you with a brick. Yes, I hear your speeches about self discipline etc., but they dont make sense anymore. If at all anything it makes you all the more sad. Its almost a coin flip. Some times, the right stimulus from loved ones comes in. Something more interesting captures your imagination. But may times, it doesn't. It feels like a cruel joke by the almighty or a nasty bug in the mind that takes you down the path of self destruction into oblivion. I think the OP is if you want to err, do it on the abstinence side.

Tyrannosaurs 13y ago

Out of interest (genuinely) do you also think people suffering from depression should just pull themselves together?

klibertp 13y ago
I downvoted GP assuming that indeed the GP would tell a depressed person to "stop externalising a blame" and "grow up". Which is actually quite a good advice for depressed people. Repeat it enough times and watch suicide rate grow rapidly... And depression rates declining! On a more serious note, people need to understand that the perceived "only in the mind" problems are actually illnesses which are much more deadly than many physiological ones. And that, by telling such things as "stop externalising a blame" (which depressed person doesn't do, anyway), you become partially responsible for the suicide if it happens. Yes, YOU GP are responsible, stop externalizing a blame and live with it. Or better yet, stop spouting nonsense.
- Tyrannosaurs 13y ago
  Having suffered from very mild depression from time to time, my view on people suggesting that depression not be seen as an illness is that it's something of a red herring, at least in terms of practical solutions. If in some strange world someone decided that a broken leg wasn't a medical condition, it wouldn't change the impact if had on the person suffering from it. Someone still couldn't run it off just because it's not deemed a medical condition. Similarly people may view depression as an illness or not but that shouldn't make the believe that reclassifying it suddenly means that someone can just pull them self together. Speaking personally in the situation I was in you could certainly tell me that but the very best that would have happened is that I could have pretended to be OK for a bit, before relapsing worse than before (which happened several times, not because people told me to pull themselves together but because life just didn't give me the bandwidth to do anything else). Similarly telling an alcoholic that they're wrong about the nature of their problem does next to nothing to actually address it - it's just meta discussion.

drstrangevibes 13y ago

you sir , are a prick