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I just keep being amazed that literate people buy this stuff. What also bugs me about this (apart from their stupidity) is that people look at me strangely whe

by Ihmahr 13y ago

I just keep being amazed that literate people buy this stuff. What also bugs me about this (apart from their stupidity) is that people look at me strangely when I decline 'medicine' on the basis that it is homeopathic. The reaction is similar when someone is refusing to drink alcohol. "Really, why not?"

seren 13y ago
I don't believe homeopathy works. However, I have seen studies mentioning that a placebo effect (which has a real measurable impact) can be triggered just by knowing you are taking a remedy, even if you know the remedy is bogus. So somehow, you are tricking yourself that you are going to get better. So in a way, you could get better by taking homeopathy even if it has nothing to do with what is (or rather is not!) in the pills. I don't see much harm in taking homeopathy for a common cold for example, however for anything more serious, you are probably endangering yourself.
- driverdan 13y ago
  Placebos can change your attitude but cannot cure anything. You may feel better but in reality nothing has changed other than the feeling.
  - seren 13y ago
    But if you can feel better, without having any possible dangerous side-effect, it is actually a powerful effect we should leverage for minor ailments. Most drugs are not trying to cure you anyway, but are only bringing you some relief. I am not trying to defend the efficiency of homeopathy there, but I am saying that triggering the placebo effect is beneficial.
  - brazzy 13y ago
    Ultimately, the goal of any cure is to make you feel better. And there is lots of evidence that psychology can have very powerful effects on your body.
    - stan_rogers 13y ago
      Indeed. Even if we dispose of any debatable improvements in recovery from various illnesses that may be caused by reducing stress, etc., that still leaves the rather broad category of physical ailments that are largely psychosomatic (that is, the physical distress, though very real, arises as a result of or is greatly exacerbated by mental state). That being said, the purely psychological effect needs to be used responsibly, scientifically (that is, the patient needs to be monitored on the basis of more than just feeling) and in conjunction with real medicine - the peddling of woo-woo on its own by people who are essentially answerable to no-one and who believe in the woo-woo (or at least disbelieve in or pathologically distrust scientific medicine) is dangerous and deadly, and it's just about time to put a permanent stop to it.
    - driverdan 13y ago
      You mean treatment. Treatment makes you feel better. A cure, uh, cures you of the problem.
- dllthomas 13y ago
  You're harming yourself in that you're paying a steep mark-up. You can probably find a cheaper placebo that's no less effective.
aestra 13y ago
>apart from their stupidity That's harsh. The average consumer doesn't have the time/expertise to go through scientific research on homeopathic medicine. Someone tells them "this is going to work" and they believe them. It might be sad, but not all humans are skeptical nor to they have the time or energy to invest in research. They may not even be aware they are buying homeopathic medicine. Homeopathic medicine is sold near the real medicine, once I picked up a pill bottle on the shelf (while buying another thing) because it caught my eye. I was like "I didn't know they could treat this." I turned it over to read the ingredients and that's when I noticed it was homeopathy. If I was in the store looking for a cure, I could have easily just picked up whatever I saw that was a "remedy" for what I was experiencing. My mother even once bought some homeopathic medicine because of a marketing campaign, having no idea it was homeopathy, and actually, I didn't know at first either, I didn't look closely at the label, it wasn't until later I saw it was. While purchasing medicine, do you turn over the bottle, examine each ingredient, then look up the science behind them? For example there "no good evidence for or against the effectiveness of OTC medications in acute cough"[1] and is probably just a placebo,[2] yet people take cough syrup all the time. Even heroin was developed to be a non-additive cough suppressant, and was marketed as such. [3] [1] http://summaries.cochrane.org/CD001831/over-the-counter-otc-medications-for-acute-cough-in-children-and-adults-in-ambulatory-settings#sthash.JKREdEcY.dpuf http://summaries.cochrane.org/CD001831/over-the-counter-otc-... [2] http://www.uptodate.com/contents/acute-bronchitis-in-adults-beyond-the-basics http://www.uptodate.com/contents/acute-bronchitis-in-adults-... [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin
- mikeash 13y ago
  I agree in general, but when it comes to medicine then people absolutely need to make the time to research the stuff. I mean, I can't fathom this question: > While purchasing medicine, do you turn over the bottle, examine each ingredient, then look up the science behind them? Who says "no" to this?! Is that really a thing? I swear, there is no hope for humanity.
pknight 13y ago
I have never taken homeopathic medicine but I am fascinated by the placebo effect. It is one of the best researched effects (because most studies have a treatment group just with placebo) with very real results. Homeopathy for some people just seems to be a good vehicle for tapping into placebo. So yes, even if you're 'smart' and 'educated' it pays to reap the benefits of that mechanism. It would be shortsighted to paint these people as lesser than. The irony is that people who feel compelled to discredit alternative approaches that have little scientific consensus are actually campaigning to take away an approach that works for some people, purely because it doesn't sit well with their beliefs. Different story, of course, is criticising the way alternative medicine is practised. I believe there is as much malpractice and fraud there as there is in mainstream medicine and the food industry, which is a pity. This story just points out a very troubling production problems. Worser still is that this is not unique to one homeopathic production company, you can find similarly outrageous problems in other industries as well.

by Ihmahr 13y ago

seren 13y ago

I don't believe homeopathy works. However, I have seen studies mentioning that a placebo effect (which has a real measurable impact) can be triggered just by knowing you are taking a remedy, even if you know the remedy is bogus. So somehow, you are tricking yourself that you are going to get better. So in a way, you could get better by taking homeopathy even if it has nothing to do with what is (or rather is not!) in the pills. I don't see much harm in taking homeopathy for a common cold for example, however for anything more serious, you are probably endangering yourself.

driverdan 13y ago
Placebos can change your attitude but cannot cure anything. You may feel better but in reality nothing has changed other than the feeling.
- seren 13y ago
  But if you can feel better, without having any possible dangerous side-effect, it is actually a powerful effect we should leverage for minor ailments. Most drugs are not trying to cure you anyway, but are only bringing you some relief. I am not trying to defend the efficiency of homeopathy there, but I am saying that triggering the placebo effect is beneficial.
- brazzy 13y ago
  Ultimately, the goal of any cure is to make you feel better. And there is lots of evidence that psychology can have very powerful effects on your body.
  - stan_rogers 13y ago
    Indeed. Even if we dispose of any debatable improvements in recovery from various illnesses that may be caused by reducing stress, etc., that still leaves the rather broad category of physical ailments that are largely psychosomatic (that is, the physical distress, though very real, arises as a result of or is greatly exacerbated by mental state). That being said, the purely psychological effect needs to be used responsibly, scientifically (that is, the patient needs to be monitored on the basis of more than just feeling) and in conjunction with real medicine - the peddling of woo-woo on its own by people who are essentially answerable to no-one and who believe in the woo-woo (or at least disbelieve in or pathologically distrust scientific medicine) is dangerous and deadly, and it's just about time to put a permanent stop to it.
  - driverdan 13y ago
    You mean treatment. Treatment makes you feel better. A cure, uh, cures you of the problem.
dllthomas 13y ago
You're harming yourself in that you're paying a steep mark-up. You can probably find a cheaper placebo that's no less effective.

aestra 13y ago

>apart from their stupidity That's harsh. The average consumer doesn't have the time/expertise to go through scientific research on homeopathic medicine. Someone tells them "this is going to work" and they believe them. It might be sad, but not all humans are skeptical nor to they have the time or energy to invest in research. They may not even be aware they are buying homeopathic medicine. Homeopathic medicine is sold near the real medicine, once I picked up a pill bottle on the shelf (while buying another thing) because it caught my eye. I was like "I didn't know they could treat this." I turned it over to read the ingredients and that's when I noticed it was homeopathy. If I was in the store looking for a cure, I could have easily just picked up whatever I saw that was a "remedy" for what I was experiencing. My mother even once bought some homeopathic medicine because of a marketing campaign, having no idea it was homeopathy, and actually, I didn't know at first either, I didn't look closely at the label, it wasn't until later I saw it was. While purchasing medicine, do you turn over the bottle, examine each ingredient, then look up the science behind them? For example there "no good evidence for or against the effectiveness of OTC medications in acute cough"[1] and is probably just a placebo,[2] yet people take cough syrup all the time. Even heroin was developed to be a non-additive cough suppressant, and was marketed as such. [3] [1] http://summaries.cochrane.org/CD001831/over-the-counter-otc-medications-for-acute-cough-in-children-and-adults-in-ambulatory-settings#sthash.JKREdEcY.dpuf http://summaries.cochrane.org/CD001831/over-the-counter-otc-... [2] http://www.uptodate.com/contents/acute-bronchitis-in-adults-beyond-the-basics http://www.uptodate.com/contents/acute-bronchitis-in-adults-... [3] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heroin

mikeash 13y ago
I agree in general, but when it comes to medicine then people absolutely need to make the time to research the stuff. I mean, I can't fathom this question: > While purchasing medicine, do you turn over the bottle, examine each ingredient, then look up the science behind them? Who says "no" to this?! Is that really a thing? I swear, there is no hope for humanity.

pknight 13y ago

I have never taken homeopathic medicine but I am fascinated by the placebo effect. It is one of the best researched effects (because most studies have a treatment group just with placebo) with very real results. Homeopathy for some people just seems to be a good vehicle for tapping into placebo. So yes, even if you're 'smart' and 'educated' it pays to reap the benefits of that mechanism. It would be shortsighted to paint these people as lesser than. The irony is that people who feel compelled to discredit alternative approaches that have little scientific consensus are actually campaigning to take away an approach that works for some people, purely because it doesn't sit well with their beliefs. Different story, of course, is criticising the way alternative medicine is practised. I believe there is as much malpractice and fraud there as there is in mainstream medicine and the food industry, which is a pity. This story just points out a very troubling production problems. Worser still is that this is not unique to one homeopathic production company, you can find similarly outrageous problems in other industries as well.