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Interesting question. As a go lover I believe it would hinder the person more than the computer. You wouldn't be able to expand the board, because then its no

Interesting question. As a go lover I believe it would hinder the person more than the computer. You wouldn't be able to expand the board, because then its no longer Go. There are three commonly used board sizes (9x9, 13x13, and 19x19). Other than that, it wouldn't be Go. The computer would have an easier time playing with a larger board because its algorithmically making moves. The experience go player wouldn't have their experience behind them.

gcp 13y ago
Some go programs (e.g. Leela) support playing on large boards, up to 37x37. Algorithmically, there are two issues: Go programs use Monte Carlo estimation by doing semi-random playouts to determine the game theoretic value of a position. The longer the game is from its end, the more noise in the estimate, which worsens the playing strength. Secondly, the longer the game is from its end, the longer the computation of a playout takes, which reduces the number of positions that can be considered in the tree search part. So in fact, no, moving up in board size does hurt the program substantially. Experience with programs like the above shows it hurts the computer more than the human.
- thinkpad20 13y ago
  Yeah, this is my thought. It seems, for example, that precisely calculating the optimal strategy would be quite tenable on a 9x9 board, because the problem space is so small. On a 19x19 board, the space is absolutely immense. It doesn't seem to make a huge difference with humans, though, because we are so adept at pattern-matching. So it seems like while a larger board would certainly make things more difficult to a human, they wouldn't really have to make many adjustments in their fundamental strategy. On the other hand, it could dramatically weaken a computer player. As to the other point raised, there doesn't seem to be any reason why it would suddenly cease to become Go if you increase the board past 19x19. The rules of Go are independent of board size, and I'm sure it took quite a long time before the "standard sizes" of 9, 13, and 19 were fixed.
  - Retric 13y ago
    Solving go on a 5x5 board takes something like 2hours on a modern PC. So, optimal play for 7x7 may be within reach but 9x9 is much much harder. PS: "Center opening results in Black taking the entire board. First play on the edge results in White taking the entire board."
    - deleted 13y ago
      [deleted]
    - thinkpad20 13y ago
      Interesting, no idea! Thanks, learned something.

gcp 13y ago

Some go programs (e.g. Leela) support playing on large boards, up to 37x37. Algorithmically, there are two issues: Go programs use Monte Carlo estimation by doing semi-random playouts to determine the game theoretic value of a position. The longer the game is from its end, the more noise in the estimate, which worsens the playing strength. Secondly, the longer the game is from its end, the longer the computation of a playout takes, which reduces the number of positions that can be considered in the tree search part. So in fact, no, moving up in board size does hurt the program substantially. Experience with programs like the above shows it hurts the computer more than the human.

thinkpad20 13y ago
Yeah, this is my thought. It seems, for example, that precisely calculating the optimal strategy would be quite tenable on a 9x9 board, because the problem space is so small. On a 19x19 board, the space is absolutely immense. It doesn't seem to make a huge difference with humans, though, because we are so adept at pattern-matching. So it seems like while a larger board would certainly make things more difficult to a human, they wouldn't really have to make many adjustments in their fundamental strategy. On the other hand, it could dramatically weaken a computer player. As to the other point raised, there doesn't seem to be any reason why it would suddenly cease to become Go if you increase the board past 19x19. The rules of Go are independent of board size, and I'm sure it took quite a long time before the "standard sizes" of 9, 13, and 19 were fixed.
- Retric 13y ago
  Solving go on a 5x5 board takes something like 2hours on a modern PC. So, optimal play for 7x7 may be within reach but 9x9 is much much harder. PS: "Center opening results in Black taking the entire board. First play on the edge results in White taking the entire board."
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
  - thinkpad20 13y ago
    Interesting, no idea! Thanks, learned something.