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What I find odd when reading these kinds of posts and the discussion that ensues is that most people don't even seem to ask if "becoming rich" is really that im

What I find odd when reading these kinds of posts and the discussion that ensues is that most people don't even seem to ask if "becoming rich" is really that important to begin with: For example, in his post the author gives the impression that only money can buy you a decent and fulfilling life and that you should better get rich quick since otherwise "you’ll be too old to enjoy it". Personally I think building up modest wealth over your entire career might be a surer and more reasonable strategy than the "get rich or die trying" model the author proposes, since the latter involves a good amount of luck and seems to work only for 1 % of the population.

giarc 13y ago
Your comment about asking whether becoming rich is really that important reminded me of a lesson I learned. I live in a city that had some major flooding recently. I volunteered to help pump out water and clean basements. I did this in primarily two neighbourhoods. A very affluent neighbourhood with multimillion dollar homes. The other neighbourhood was middle class, 30-50 year old bungalows. In the affluent neighbourhood, the neighbours all hated each other. It seemed like at some point, everyone had done something to piss off someone else. We set up a large pump on a driveway and were told by the neighbour that we had to move the pump since it was on their side of the driveway (which they were not using). The neighbour also moved the 4 inch pipe into their neighbours garden which basically acted as an excavator until we noticed it. It was actually upsetting to see in times of such crisis. Other the other hand, and you likely can predict how this story will go, the middle class neighbourhood was full of community, helping hands and people willing to go out of their way to assist others. It actually came to a point where there was too much help. People were driving around with coffee and home made sandwiches which they couldn't give out because 3 other cars with the same had just driven by. People were thankful and would rush across the street to help you move a heavy refrigerator. I realized over that week that if getting rich means hating your neighbours/being hated by your neighbours, having no one to reach out to, maybe I don't want to be rich. At least not financially rich.
- mildtrepidation 13y ago
  I realized over that week that if getting rich means hating your neighbours/being hated by your neighbours, having no one to reach out to, maybe I don't want to be rich. At least not financially rich. Or at least not in that neighborhood. You have an anecdote... that's all. I'm sure there are others that match it, but being a dick to your neighbors and having neighbors that are dicks to you is not a necessary pre- or post-condition of financial wealth. You can end up in that situation regardless of how much money you make. What you should probably take away from that experience is that you value community and wish to have positive interactions with your neighbors; perhaps financial wealth shouldn't be a priority for you, but I don't believe this situation could really inform you on that point.
  - giarc 13y ago
    I don't think my point was to say "Getting rich means you will hate your neighbours" but more of a "Getting rich doesn't bring instant gratification." A "money can't by happiness" type message.
- will_work4tears 13y ago
  Or just build up a modest wealth (no necessarily "rich") and live in a neighborhood like the middle class one you mention. Nobody has to know what you make. Personally I see this happening for me if I ever "Strike it rich." (or build my own product and work hard at making it highly profitable, whichever actually happens)
  - giarc 13y ago
    If you'll allow, another story. I grew up in a small town with a prestigious private school. I was no where near rich enough to attend. However there were other "townies" with parents as doctors or dentists that could afford to attend. Even though they were rich by small town standards they were seen as poor by the students with parents that were even wealthier. So perhaps even when you are rich, you can still feel poor. So I think you are right, maybe it's better to be the richest in the middle class neighbourhood, then the poorest in the upper class neighbourhood.
MicroBerto 13y ago
Man this thread really has me wanting to get my personal blog going again. First off, MJ recently discussed in his forum (which I no longer frequent, I like it here better) about how he had too much stuff, and was happy just hanging out in his GF's small apartment. So even very wealthy people can have these types of existential crises. Now here's my untested thesis that I'd like to blog about: In the US, there was a study that shows something like "happiness stops growing after 75k". There are several reasons, but I feel that a large part of it is that once you have over 75k income, you start buying more things which end up causing you more problems. That Mercedes that always needs repair? That big suburban house that needs constant work? Wife wants to go on vacations, pressure to have kids, etc etc. So now you're making 125k, but you're no happier than someone making 50k. Because: * You're working harder for the 125k * You have more crap cluttering your life, and it keeps breaking and finding ways to abuse your time. * You're invited to more parties and social events, especially if you have kids. YET, you're still not making so much money that you can afford to have someone handle the small stuff for you. So you're awash in crap and tiny things and the next thing you know, you're not doing what you truly enjoy. you're running errands. So it becomes a Mo' Money Mo' Problems type situation. * One solution is to live minimalistically. Something I personally prefer. * Another solution is to get rich enough and have an assistant, cook, maid, etc do the small stuff for you, so you can enjoy your time again instead of running errands all day. This is also what I'm going after. * A third solution is to move to a cheaper country. Anyway, the point is, you don't need to be rich. But if you want the "stuff", you're going to get a hell of a lot of headaches that go along with it, unless you're seriously ballin enough to not give a crap about hiring people to do the nonsense work. Otherwise, you're just paying for more work for yourself. That's my little offtopic thesis. I need to get back to work now.
- ThePhysicist 13y ago
  Yeah I remember reading this story as well, here's the link to the WSJ that covered it when it came out back in 2010: http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2010/09/07/the-perfect-salary-for-happiness-75000-a-year/ http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2010/09/07/the-perfect-salary-fo...

giarc 13y ago

Your comment about asking whether becoming rich is really that important reminded me of a lesson I learned. I live in a city that had some major flooding recently. I volunteered to help pump out water and clean basements. I did this in primarily two neighbourhoods. A very affluent neighbourhood with multimillion dollar homes. The other neighbourhood was middle class, 30-50 year old bungalows. In the affluent neighbourhood, the neighbours all hated each other. It seemed like at some point, everyone had done something to piss off someone else. We set up a large pump on a driveway and were told by the neighbour that we had to move the pump since it was on their side of the driveway (which they were not using). The neighbour also moved the 4 inch pipe into their neighbours garden which basically acted as an excavator until we noticed it. It was actually upsetting to see in times of such crisis. Other the other hand, and you likely can predict how this story will go, the middle class neighbourhood was full of community, helping hands and people willing to go out of their way to assist others. It actually came to a point where there was too much help. People were driving around with coffee and home made sandwiches which they couldn't give out because 3 other cars with the same had just driven by. People were thankful and would rush across the street to help you move a heavy refrigerator. I realized over that week that if getting rich means hating your neighbours/being hated by your neighbours, having no one to reach out to, maybe I don't want to be rich. At least not financially rich.

mildtrepidation 13y ago
I realized over that week that if getting rich means hating your neighbours/being hated by your neighbours, having no one to reach out to, maybe I don't want to be rich. At least not financially rich. Or at least not in that neighborhood. You have an anecdote... that's all. I'm sure there are others that match it, but being a dick to your neighbors and having neighbors that are dicks to you is not a necessary pre- or post-condition of financial wealth. You can end up in that situation regardless of how much money you make. What you should probably take away from that experience is that you value community and wish to have positive interactions with your neighbors; perhaps financial wealth shouldn't be a priority for you, but I don't believe this situation could really inform you on that point.
- giarc 13y ago
  I don't think my point was to say "Getting rich means you will hate your neighbours" but more of a "Getting rich doesn't bring instant gratification." A "money can't by happiness" type message.
will_work4tears 13y ago
Or just build up a modest wealth (no necessarily "rich") and live in a neighborhood like the middle class one you mention. Nobody has to know what you make. Personally I see this happening for me if I ever "Strike it rich." (or build my own product and work hard at making it highly profitable, whichever actually happens)
- giarc 13y ago
  If you'll allow, another story. I grew up in a small town with a prestigious private school. I was no where near rich enough to attend. However there were other "townies" with parents as doctors or dentists that could afford to attend. Even though they were rich by small town standards they were seen as poor by the students with parents that were even wealthier. So perhaps even when you are rich, you can still feel poor. So I think you are right, maybe it's better to be the richest in the middle class neighbourhood, then the poorest in the upper class neighbourhood.

MicroBerto 13y ago

Man this thread really has me wanting to get my personal blog going again. First off, MJ recently discussed in his forum (which I no longer frequent, I like it here better) about how he had too much stuff, and was happy just hanging out in his GF's small apartment. So even very wealthy people can have these types of existential crises. Now here's my untested thesis that I'd like to blog about: In the US, there was a study that shows something like "happiness stops growing after 75k". There are several reasons, but I feel that a large part of it is that once you have over 75k income, you start buying more things which end up causing you more problems. That Mercedes that always needs repair? That big suburban house that needs constant work? Wife wants to go on vacations, pressure to have kids, etc etc. So now you're making 125k, but you're no happier than someone making 50k. Because: * You're working harder for the 125k * You have more crap cluttering your life, and it keeps breaking and finding ways to abuse your time. * You're invited to more parties and social events, especially if you have kids. YET, you're still not making so much money that you can afford to have someone handle the small stuff for you. So you're awash in crap and tiny things and the next thing you know, you're not doing what you truly enjoy. you're running errands. So it becomes a Mo' Money Mo' Problems type situation. * One solution is to live minimalistically. Something I personally prefer. * Another solution is to get rich enough and have an assistant, cook, maid, etc do the small stuff for you, so you can enjoy your time again instead of running errands all day. This is also what I'm going after. * A third solution is to move to a cheaper country. Anyway, the point is, you don't need to be rich. But if you want the "stuff", you're going to get a hell of a lot of headaches that go along with it, unless you're seriously ballin enough to not give a crap about hiring people to do the nonsense work. Otherwise, you're just paying for more work for yourself. That's my little offtopic thesis. I need to get back to work now.

ThePhysicist 13y ago
Yeah I remember reading this story as well, here's the link to the WSJ that covered it when it came out back in 2010: http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2010/09/07/the-perfect-salary-for-happiness-75000-a-year/ http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2010/09/07/the-perfect-salary-fo...