4 ms·

Some (most?) people are entirely capable of separating their professional views from their political views. I actually find it more troubling that people belie

Some (most?) people are entirely capable of separating their professional views from their political views. I actually find it more troubling that people believe you can't make that separation.

ronaldx 13y ago
I do not prefer to support a business where the direct result is that profits go towards lobbying against my human rights. I consider this a professional view on the matter - it directly relates to the running of the business. In the end, professional views are political views. If you believe you have separated those, you are naive.
- kevingadd 13y ago
  I think what someone uses their paycheck for is their business. It'd definitely be unacceptable if Mozilla as an organization was involved in prop 8 or anything similar, but I'd bet you anything that Eich isn't the only employee of Mozilla that spends part of their paycheck on something you object to. From the other perspective, how do you think staunch conservatives feel about their business's profits going towards supporting things they find objectionable? Fairness in this regard protects everyone equally.
  - ronaldx 13y ago
    >I think what someone uses their paycheck for is their business. It's funny you should put it like this, because I think who someone falls in love with and gets married to is their business. Edited to add - the comment in reply to this contains a false quote: In no way would I seek to prevent Eich from being CEO of whatever business. I would just not financially or morally support that business if I had an alternative choice. I consider that an essential part of equality - I have a right to support businesses that I choose and I prefer to exercise that right with some respect toward the moral and ethical consequences.
    - kevingadd 13y ago
      If you apply the 'Eich shouldn't work for Mozilla because he's a bigot' principle equally, that means bigots can prevent you from working anywhere. This is obviously unacceptable, and as it happens the law forbids it. As much as I don't agree with (or respect) his politics, equality has to be paramount here. It's not false equality, or equality-when-convenient: In these matters actual equality is incredibly important, so I will continue to defend it no matter how angry people are.
      - alexqgb 13y ago
        Uh, there's a big difference between simply "working for" a company and being the CEO. Do you honestly not recognize this? Or were you deliberately downplaying the nature of his role as deliberate act of spin?
    - kybernetikos 13y ago
      > financially or morally support that business if I had an alternative choice. I don't believe there is an alternative to mozilla. Happy to be proved wrong.
legutierr 13y ago
But isn't Mozilla, in fact, itself a political organization? Its "manefesto", for instance, articulates broad public policy goals before it talks about its own products or institutional objectives (just the word "manefesto" has overt political overtones). [0] More generally, it is a non-profit that for many is a standard bearer for the open-source movement, not a corporation the success of which can be judged primarily by the value it accrues to its shareholders (who might not care about politics as long as profits were delivered). Perhaps you could argue that Brendan Eich's personal politics are compatible with Mozilla's politics, but I don't think that you should assert that they aren't relevant, just because they arguably shouldn't be relevant in the context of a for-profit business. It seems prudent to expect that the political views of the CEO of a non-profit like Mozilla will have an integral effect on its mission and trajectory, at least within the policy space that is the focus of that organization. And in turn, it seems reasonable to expect that the constituency which that non-profit serves would care very much about the personal politics of its CEO. [0] http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/manifesto/ http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/manifesto/
awesomerobot 13y ago
They're entirely capable of not talking about them, sure... but are they really setting aside their entire moral fiber when they clock in?

Some (most?) people are entirely capable of separating their professional views from their political views. I actually find it more troubling that people believe you can't make that separation.

ronaldx 13y ago

I do not prefer to support a business where the direct result is that profits go towards lobbying against my human rights. I consider this a professional view on the matter - it directly relates to the running of the business. In the end, professional views are political views. If you believe you have separated those, you are naive.

kevingadd 13y ago
I think what someone uses their paycheck for is their business. It'd definitely be unacceptable if Mozilla as an organization was involved in prop 8 or anything similar, but I'd bet you anything that Eich isn't the only employee of Mozilla that spends part of their paycheck on something you object to. From the other perspective, how do you think staunch conservatives feel about their business's profits going towards supporting things they find objectionable? Fairness in this regard protects everyone equally.
- ronaldx 13y ago
  >I think what someone uses their paycheck for is their business. It's funny you should put it like this, because I think who someone falls in love with and gets married to is their business. Edited to add - the comment in reply to this contains a false quote: In no way would I seek to prevent Eich from being CEO of whatever business. I would just not financially or morally support that business if I had an alternative choice. I consider that an essential part of equality - I have a right to support businesses that I choose and I prefer to exercise that right with some respect toward the moral and ethical consequences.
  - kevingadd 13y ago
    If you apply the 'Eich shouldn't work for Mozilla because he's a bigot' principle equally, that means bigots can prevent you from working anywhere. This is obviously unacceptable, and as it happens the law forbids it. As much as I don't agree with (or respect) his politics, equality has to be paramount here. It's not false equality, or equality-when-convenient: In these matters actual equality is incredibly important, so I will continue to defend it no matter how angry people are.
    - alexqgb 13y ago
      Uh, there's a big difference between simply "working for" a company and being the CEO. Do you honestly not recognize this? Or were you deliberately downplaying the nature of his role as deliberate act of spin?
  - kybernetikos 13y ago
    > financially or morally support that business if I had an alternative choice. I don't believe there is an alternative to mozilla. Happy to be proved wrong.

legutierr 13y ago

But isn't Mozilla, in fact, itself a political organization? Its "manefesto", for instance, articulates broad public policy goals before it talks about its own products or institutional objectives (just the word "manefesto" has overt political overtones). [0] More generally, it is a non-profit that for many is a standard bearer for the open-source movement, not a corporation the success of which can be judged primarily by the value it accrues to its shareholders (who might not care about politics as long as profits were delivered). Perhaps you could argue that Brendan Eich's personal politics are compatible with Mozilla's politics, but I don't think that you should assert that they aren't relevant, just because they arguably shouldn't be relevant in the context of a for-profit business. It seems prudent to expect that the political views of the CEO of a non-profit like Mozilla will have an integral effect on its mission and trajectory, at least within the policy space that is the focus of that organization. And in turn, it seems reasonable to expect that the constituency which that non-profit serves would care very much about the personal politics of its CEO. [0] http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/manifesto/ http://www.mozilla.org/en-US/about/manifesto/

awesomerobot 13y ago

They're entirely capable of not talking about them, sure... but are they really setting aside their entire moral fiber when they clock in?