5 ms·

Icon Driven Development on the App Store- how we make $350/day without marketing

71 points by colinplamondon 17y ago

Derrek 17y ago
Colin, congrats on the success! It's nice to hear an App Store success story instead of the usual bad news.
- colinplamondon 17y ago
  Thanks Derrek! The App Store is definitely a great way to make money, though it's of course up to developers to execute and position themselves well. For us, the only issue is communication- we've now had a Kindle companion application, Kindling, in review for 94 days, without any communication outside of form responses from Apple. We take the long view- the App Store is currently the best mobile platform, but we're working on expanding our business to other platforms. I think it's pretty crazy for any developer to be focused on one platform exclusively, and have 100% of their revenue capable of being destroyed with a single click of the 'Remove from Sale' button in Cupertino.
credo 17y ago
Congrats on the success. It looks like you're getting around 250 downloads a day. That is great If the 8th ranked app is getting 250 downloads a day, it looks like the Books category is more lucrative than people may have thought.
- colinplamondon 17y ago
  A lot of our revenue actually comes from the rest of the world- Australia, Canada, and the UK are all solid, and we've been in #1 Books for Canada for solid stretches. We're actually 25 spots away from being Top 100 overall right now in Canada, so much of our revenue is attributed to the world, and not just the US. This is something we're going to expand on a lot more moving forward, as it's caught us by surprise.
  - credo 17y ago
    Thanks for the additional info. You're right, I forgot to account for the fact that the 250 downloads is a "world" total and not the "US" total. Do US sales generally account for roughly half your sales. If so, 8th place at 125 downloads is still pretty good for the "Books" category.
BigZaphod 17y ago
Was it really the icon's graphic design, or the fact that the word "free" is positioned very prominently within it? It'd be an interesting experiment to actually change the app icon for a month and test the results. Of course that's risking real money, so it'd be understandable if you didn't want to take the chance. :)
- colinplamondon 17y ago
  Good question- it's both, and the color scheme. If you pull up the Book category, most of the icons suck- plain, generic, bookcase after bookcase. So, a big red icon that also states FREE prominently is sure to get stand out. Based on how we moved up the list, I attribute most of the sales growth to increased visibility from our icon as we moved up the Top 100 list, assuming that search traffic from things like 'Free Books' would remain relatively steady.
stingraycharles 17y ago
how we make $350/day without marketing Designing a logo which stands out compared to competitors around you: I would say this is a textbook case of marketing. Having said that, it is clever using a free marketing opportunity like that, and, even better, being (one of) the first to realize there's a huge opportunity there. All I hope is that I won't be asked to punch any monkeys while browsing the AppStore any time soon. :)
- quizbiz 17y ago
  perhaps he means $350/day without advertising?
  - colinplamondon 17y ago
    Yup, my bad- $350/day without advertising would be more accurate. I think of most of the icon/description/sales page work as positioning than as marketing, but that's probably splitting hairs too much.
gojomo 17y ago
Yes, nothing signifies "free books" like a Soviet hammer-and-sickle. Who knows where the world would be today if the USSR hadn't kept the flame of publisher freedom alive through the darkest days of the cold war, when dissidents had to smuggle mimeographed copies of banned books into Paris, London, and New York. Wait, that's not how it was?
- trickjarrett 17y ago
  Cavemen didn't have car insurance either.
  - gojomo 17y ago
    The Soviets banned books and imprisoned dissident authors. The icon's graphic design romanticizes Soviet imagery, and in the context of 'free' books. That's a different level of values-incongruity than using cavemen as a minority-group stand-in for laughs. Also, I don't expect cavemen to be a threat in my lifetime, but censorship in the service of a new utopian program is an everpresent danger. Rehabilitating Soviet symbols to mean something cool and related to free expression obscures an important lesson from the 20th century.
    - colinplamondon 17y ago
      It's an interesting point, and one I'm surprised hasn't been brought up yet in the conversation. In fact, I've never received an email from a customer or potential customer about the negative aspects of the icon, while we've gotten a bunch from people who really like the approach to design and copywriting on both the site, the description page, and the app itself. So, two things: a) Business side. We certainly lose out on some customers who are turned off by the icon- that's probably the case with yourself. You posted in another thread saying you'd be interested in our upcoming Free Audiobooks app, so maybe we'll lose that sale based on the icon. Based on past performance I'm confident that the upside of extra sales gained balances the downside of sales lost- that's what makes the icon effective. It stands out because most folks wouldn't be comfortable offering it, which is why there aren't a million icons that look just like it. It's a risk, and it's paying off. b) Romanticization of a brutal dictatorship. I feel it mocks the Soviets more than anything- it's over the top and campy. Like on freebooksapp.com - "Free Books. Better than vodka. Great success!". Cheap laugh? For sure. But it converts phenomenally, with 2.5 minutes average time on site and 15% bounce rate in primary markets, and positive customer feedback in email. If you look at the browse page (freebooksapp.com/browse) it's clearly done campy/mocking, not romanticizing- "selection like glorious grocery store!". Taking the application flow as a whole, I just don't think there's any way that anyone can take this as a vote for communism. I'm glad you made the comment, though, because it's good to have feedback in the negative side of the box- it concerned me in the back of my head that I hadn't had ANY negative emails about it.
pxlpshr 17y ago
Great success story on bootstrapping your business, and a big congrats because it's very a difficult road and will surely challenge your nerves and sanity. :) If your app has only been for sale for ~1 month, I encourage you to be very conservative with your spending — the AppStore is extremely volatile. While the momentum is in your favor with the Top Charts, I suggest you keep your eyes focused on improving the iPhone app and pushing updates. The other mobile markets aren't mature enough yet to approach aggressively, and sales on the AppStore could fall as quickly as they came.

Colin, congrats on the success! It's nice to hear an App Store success story instead of the usual bad news.

colinplamondon 17y ago
Thanks Derrek! The App Store is definitely a great way to make money, though it's of course up to developers to execute and position themselves well. For us, the only issue is communication- we've now had a Kindle companion application, Kindling, in review for 94 days, without any communication outside of form responses from Apple. We take the long view- the App Store is currently the best mobile platform, but we're working on expanding our business to other platforms. I think it's pretty crazy for any developer to be focused on one platform exclusively, and have 100% of their revenue capable of being destroyed with a single click of the 'Remove from Sale' button in Cupertino.

credo 17y ago

Congrats on the success. It looks like you're getting around 250 downloads a day. That is great If the 8th ranked app is getting 250 downloads a day, it looks like the Books category is more lucrative than people may have thought.

colinplamondon 17y ago
A lot of our revenue actually comes from the rest of the world- Australia, Canada, and the UK are all solid, and we've been in #1 Books for Canada for solid stretches. We're actually 25 spots away from being Top 100 overall right now in Canada, so much of our revenue is attributed to the world, and not just the US. This is something we're going to expand on a lot more moving forward, as it's caught us by surprise.
- credo 17y ago
  Thanks for the additional info. You're right, I forgot to account for the fact that the 250 downloads is a "world" total and not the "US" total. Do US sales generally account for roughly half your sales. If so, 8th place at 125 downloads is still pretty good for the "Books" category.

BigZaphod 17y ago

Was it really the icon's graphic design, or the fact that the word "free" is positioned very prominently within it? It'd be an interesting experiment to actually change the app icon for a month and test the results. Of course that's risking real money, so it'd be understandable if you didn't want to take the chance. :)

colinplamondon 17y ago
Good question- it's both, and the color scheme. If you pull up the Book category, most of the icons suck- plain, generic, bookcase after bookcase. So, a big red icon that also states FREE prominently is sure to get stand out. Based on how we moved up the list, I attribute most of the sales growth to increased visibility from our icon as we moved up the Top 100 list, assuming that search traffic from things like 'Free Books' would remain relatively steady.

stingraycharles 17y ago

how we make $350/day without marketing Designing a logo which stands out compared to competitors around you: I would say this is a textbook case of marketing. Having said that, it is clever using a free marketing opportunity like that, and, even better, being (one of) the first to realize there's a huge opportunity there. All I hope is that I won't be asked to punch any monkeys while browsing the AppStore any time soon. :)

quizbiz 17y ago
perhaps he means $350/day without advertising?
- colinplamondon 17y ago
  Yup, my bad- $350/day without advertising would be more accurate. I think of most of the icon/description/sales page work as positioning than as marketing, but that's probably splitting hairs too much.

gojomo 17y ago

Yes, nothing signifies "free books" like a Soviet hammer-and-sickle. Who knows where the world would be today if the USSR hadn't kept the flame of publisher freedom alive through the darkest days of the cold war, when dissidents had to smuggle mimeographed copies of banned books into Paris, London, and New York. Wait, that's not how it was?

trickjarrett 17y ago
Cavemen didn't have car insurance either.
- gojomo 17y ago
  The Soviets banned books and imprisoned dissident authors. The icon's graphic design romanticizes Soviet imagery, and in the context of 'free' books. That's a different level of values-incongruity than using cavemen as a minority-group stand-in for laughs. Also, I don't expect cavemen to be a threat in my lifetime, but censorship in the service of a new utopian program is an everpresent danger. Rehabilitating Soviet symbols to mean something cool and related to free expression obscures an important lesson from the 20th century.
  - colinplamondon 17y ago
    It's an interesting point, and one I'm surprised hasn't been brought up yet in the conversation. In fact, I've never received an email from a customer or potential customer about the negative aspects of the icon, while we've gotten a bunch from people who really like the approach to design and copywriting on both the site, the description page, and the app itself. So, two things: a) Business side. We certainly lose out on some customers who are turned off by the icon- that's probably the case with yourself. You posted in another thread saying you'd be interested in our upcoming Free Audiobooks app, so maybe we'll lose that sale based on the icon. Based on past performance I'm confident that the upside of extra sales gained balances the downside of sales lost- that's what makes the icon effective. It stands out because most folks wouldn't be comfortable offering it, which is why there aren't a million icons that look just like it. It's a risk, and it's paying off. b) Romanticization of a brutal dictatorship. I feel it mocks the Soviets more than anything- it's over the top and campy. Like on freebooksapp.com - "Free Books. Better than vodka. Great success!". Cheap laugh? For sure. But it converts phenomenally, with 2.5 minutes average time on site and 15% bounce rate in primary markets, and positive customer feedback in email. If you look at the browse page (freebooksapp.com/browse) it's clearly done campy/mocking, not romanticizing- "selection like glorious grocery store!". Taking the application flow as a whole, I just don't think there's any way that anyone can take this as a vote for communism. I'm glad you made the comment, though, because it's good to have feedback in the negative side of the box- it concerned me in the back of my head that I hadn't had ANY negative emails about it.

pxlpshr 17y ago

Great success story on bootstrapping your business, and a big congrats because it's very a difficult road and will surely challenge your nerves and sanity. :) If your app has only been for sale for ~1 month, I encourage you to be very conservative with your spending — the AppStore is extremely volatile. While the momentum is in your favor with the Top Charts, I suggest you keep your eyes focused on improving the iPhone app and pushing updates. The other mobile markets aren't mature enough yet to approach aggressively, and sales on the AppStore could fall as quickly as they came.