4 ms·

It seems to me that MS had every right to chase down this pair of nincompoops. Technically they had the right to scan the unnamed blogger's email, and surely t

It seems to me that MS had every right to chase down this pair of nincompoops. Technically they had the right to scan the unnamed blogger's email, and surely they had the right and justification to check ex-employee Kibkalo's Skydrive account for traces of illegally obtained files. Maybe there should be some kind of more normal procedure such as a court order rather than merely the "approval of Microsoft's lawyers", but either way they had justification. The blogger had obtained keys to a new server release and potentially he or his customers could use it to create highly insecure or spoofed installations, could they not? Methinks the world is a safer place now that the leaker was caught. By the way what's Microsoft doing employing some Russian guy living in Lebanon, anyway? The whole situation sounds a bit iffy.

epistasis 13y ago
The prevalence of this opinion undermines not only Microsofts email service, but also their cloud services. If it's too widespread, it undermines others' online services. I'm already thinking I need to consider moving off Google Apps...
- booruguru 13y ago
  There have always been concerns about the security of "the cloud"...but always in the sense of hackers breaking into the data. None of us ever considered that providers would simply give themselves permission to review our data. After a story like this, how on earth could any corporation blindly trust a cloud provider with their data? I know many people simply do not care about their rights and freedoms, but I find this latest development incredibly disturbing. However, I see this as a great opportunity for a company of good character to make a name for itself by promoting services with the assurance that their databases are encrypted in such a way that even they can't access our data.
  - danieldk 13y ago
    After a story like this, how on earth could any corporation blindly trust a cloud provider with their data? By using an e-mail service that does not have such clauses in their terms of service, or even better, guarantee that they won't read your e-mail. Because if they do, it makes it a lot easier to sue them. Of course, e-mail is inherently insecure. Even with PGP encryption, the metadata is visible by every SMTP server on a message's route. So, don't expect privacy when using e-mail.
    - epistasis 13y ago
      Do you know of any such email service? Google, Apple, and Yahoo will all read your email: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/mar/21/yahoo-google-and-apple-claim-right-to-read-user-emails http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/mar/21/yahoo-goog...
leoc 13y ago
> Maybe there should be some kind of more normal procedure such as a court order rather than merely the "approval of Microsoft's lawyers", but either way they had justification. IANAL but I suspect that if MS had gone to a court seeking an order against itself, or if MS had set up some other legal entity to sue MS on MS' own behalf, they'd have been thrown out of court for timewasting.
- blisterpeanuts 13y ago
  I'm not a lawyer either, but I believe that normal due process procedures in the U.S. include going to the police or FBI who can then obtain a search warrant from the jurisdictional court, and they can then examine the contents of the suspect's account. Apparently, MS didn't do that, but they probably could have. In any event, they did involve the FBI as evidenced by the FBI report linked by the article.
Drakim 13y ago
It needs to be stressed that they did not just check the Hotmail of the leaker, but also the Hotmail the one the leaker emailed. So for my Hotmail account to be opened and read by Microsoft's personnel without a warrant, all I need to be is the willing or unwilling recipient of an email from a person whose activities Microsoft deem to be illegal/bad? What happens if some well known internet pirate sends me an email with an attachment? Will an justified Microsoft go on a fishing trip in my inbox to find any juicy illegal activities? One could say that this is what I get for using Hotmail, but no way in hell can Microsoft maintain that "we are the good guys in privacy" that they have in their campaign against Google.
- basch 13y ago
  And did Microsoft read the recipients other messages? Do you think maybe they only looked at the ones from the leaker? Do you really think they had a person manually thumb through every one of the journalists messages?
skrebbel 13y ago
> By the way what's Microsoft doing employing some Russian guy living in Lebanon, anyway? Seriously, what the fuck? Why can't Microsoft, or any company, employ Russian expats in Lebanon? It's foreign (to you) so it's "iffy"?
- blisterpeanuts 13y ago
  Yes.
walshemj 13y ago
Why should Microsoft have extrajudicial powers that exceed those of the NSA and the Police? When I worked for BT if say some one in marketing had done that our internal security department would have fucking crucified them - read Bruces resignation letter and note how carefull he is to make nice with SD.
- cheald 13y ago
  What the hell? Extrajudicial powers? Microsoft isn't a part of the executive branch of the government, and doesn't legally need anyone's permission to look at their own servers. We can have a discussion on whether it's ethical or not, but framing it as a legal matter is bonkers.

epistasis 13y ago

The prevalence of this opinion undermines not only Microsofts email service, but also their cloud services. If it's too widespread, it undermines others' online services. I'm already thinking I need to consider moving off Google Apps...

booruguru 13y ago
There have always been concerns about the security of "the cloud"...but always in the sense of hackers breaking into the data. None of us ever considered that providers would simply give themselves permission to review our data. After a story like this, how on earth could any corporation blindly trust a cloud provider with their data? I know many people simply do not care about their rights and freedoms, but I find this latest development incredibly disturbing. However, I see this as a great opportunity for a company of good character to make a name for itself by promoting services with the assurance that their databases are encrypted in such a way that even they can't access our data.
- danieldk 13y ago
  After a story like this, how on earth could any corporation blindly trust a cloud provider with their data? By using an e-mail service that does not have such clauses in their terms of service, or even better, guarantee that they won't read your e-mail. Because if they do, it makes it a lot easier to sue them. Of course, e-mail is inherently insecure. Even with PGP encryption, the metadata is visible by every SMTP server on a message's route. So, don't expect privacy when using e-mail.
  - epistasis 13y ago
    Do you know of any such email service? Google, Apple, and Yahoo will all read your email: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/mar/21/yahoo-google-and-apple-claim-right-to-read-user-emails http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2014/mar/21/yahoo-goog...

leoc 13y ago

> Maybe there should be some kind of more normal procedure such as a court order rather than merely the "approval of Microsoft's lawyers", but either way they had justification. IANAL but I suspect that if MS had gone to a court seeking an order against itself, or if MS had set up some other legal entity to sue MS on MS' own behalf, they'd have been thrown out of court for timewasting.

blisterpeanuts 13y ago
I'm not a lawyer either, but I believe that normal due process procedures in the U.S. include going to the police or FBI who can then obtain a search warrant from the jurisdictional court, and they can then examine the contents of the suspect's account. Apparently, MS didn't do that, but they probably could have. In any event, they did involve the FBI as evidenced by the FBI report linked by the article.

Drakim 13y ago

It needs to be stressed that they did not just check the Hotmail of the leaker, but also the Hotmail the one the leaker emailed. So for my Hotmail account to be opened and read by Microsoft's personnel without a warrant, all I need to be is the willing or unwilling recipient of an email from a person whose activities Microsoft deem to be illegal/bad? What happens if some well known internet pirate sends me an email with an attachment? Will an justified Microsoft go on a fishing trip in my inbox to find any juicy illegal activities? One could say that this is what I get for using Hotmail, but no way in hell can Microsoft maintain that "we are the good guys in privacy" that they have in their campaign against Google.

basch 13y ago
And did Microsoft read the recipients other messages? Do you think maybe they only looked at the ones from the leaker? Do you really think they had a person manually thumb through every one of the journalists messages?

skrebbel 13y ago

> By the way what's Microsoft doing employing some Russian guy living in Lebanon, anyway? Seriously, what the fuck? Why can't Microsoft, or any company, employ Russian expats in Lebanon? It's foreign (to you) so it's "iffy"?

blisterpeanuts 13y ago
Yes.

walshemj 13y ago

Why should Microsoft have extrajudicial powers that exceed those of the NSA and the Police? When I worked for BT if say some one in marketing had done that our internal security department would have fucking crucified them - read Bruces resignation letter and note how carefull he is to make nice with SD.

cheald 13y ago
What the hell? Extrajudicial powers? Microsoft isn't a part of the executive branch of the government, and doesn't legally need anyone's permission to look at their own servers. We can have a discussion on whether it's ethical or not, but framing it as a legal matter is bonkers.