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I just can't get over feeling conflicted about what Musk is trying to accomplish vs. what a misogynistic creep he seems to be in his personal life. Is this rea

by patja 13y ago

I just can't get over feeling conflicted about what Musk is trying to accomplish vs. what a misogynistic creep he seems to be in his personal life. Is this really the person who should be lauded as the savior of humanity? I always had similar feelings about Lance Armstrong too.

fixermark 13y ago
Sadly, history is full of "saviors of humanity" with undesirable local-sphere characteristics. These are pretty orthogonal elements, it seems. You can certainly restrict your lauding to people who succeeded in both the world-changing and good-local-interaction spheres. Your laud-space will be commensurately smaller, but I don't think it's zero.
Permit 13y ago
Why does Elon Musk strike you as a misogynistic creep? It seems like that kind of claim warrants some justification.
- patja 13y ago
  misogyny may be a bit speculative, but from reading the following: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/29/divorce-wars-justine-musk_n_841761.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/29/divorce-wars-justin... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lisa-belkin/elon-musk-parenting-discussion-sxsw-interactive_b_2868831.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lisa-belkin/elon-musk-parentin... http://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/relationship-issues/millionaire-starter-wife http://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/relationship-issues/mill... he definitely falls into the creep class in my book. I hope neither of my daughters ever gets into a relationship with someone who shares his worldview and says stuff like "if you were my employee I would fire you" to them. Or asking where he can find a new girlfriend that can fit into a 10 hour per week time budget. What a cad. Then there are the kids. The kids he admits he doesn't spend enough time with (and even then says he can be a great dad spending time with them while simultaneously working. Multitasking for the win!) and who have been through the divorce. Again, just my own biases and take on the world that I am sure aren't shared by all, but I can categorically say that every single person I know whose parents divorced when they were young has resulting damage they carry to this day, into their own marriages and parenting.
  - jack-r-abbit 13y ago
    To be fair, two of those links are told from the point of view of his ex-wife. The world is full of people that have rather harsh things to say about their exes. Some of it is true.
  - pekk 13y ago
    Choosing a demanding career and suffering a divorce - what a misogynistic cad.
vezzy-fnord 13y ago
The problem is that you probably have some sort of unrealistic godlike caricature of who he is. He's an extremely idealistic, prolific and successful startup founder. Whether he is the "savior of humanity" is a different topic, although plenty do tend to exaggerate. It's largely because ambitious founders project their hopes and dreams onto him and revere him. Which is a normal psychological occurrence, but also emotionally driven. Musk is a fallible human like anyone else. Why should his misogyny (can you back that up by the way, I'm not aware?) deflect from his business endeavors? The thing is you'll always disagree with people on certain things. It seems to me like you're trying too hard to find something to get offended over. I enjoy the works of plenty of people whom I ideologically disagree with, but it poses no grievance to me. Separate the actor from the act.
- patja 13y ago
  I like his work and his ideas and what he is accomplishing. And I am certain my approval or disapproval for his character matters not a bit to anything external to myself. Given how he expresses himself and his pattern of prioritizing those nominally closest to himself, I just don't like the idea of Musk attaining a role model status, a direction his celebrity seems to point towards.
benched 13y ago
Oh please. I'm really sure this is completely based in fact, and doesn't involve anybody being oversensitive, judgmental, or self-righteous.
jack-r-abbit 13y ago
I think many would say that about Steve Jobs. You don't have to be a good person to do good things.
- VeejayRampay 13y ago
  s/do good things/be rich and successful/

by patja 13y ago

fixermark 13y ago

Sadly, history is full of "saviors of humanity" with undesirable local-sphere characteristics. These are pretty orthogonal elements, it seems. You can certainly restrict your lauding to people who succeeded in both the world-changing and good-local-interaction spheres. Your laud-space will be commensurately smaller, but I don't think it's zero.

Permit 13y ago

Why does Elon Musk strike you as a misogynistic creep? It seems like that kind of claim warrants some justification.

patja 13y ago
misogyny may be a bit speculative, but from reading the following: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/29/divorce-wars-justine-musk_n_841761.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/29/divorce-wars-justin... http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lisa-belkin/elon-musk-parenting-discussion-sxsw-interactive_b_2868831.html http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lisa-belkin/elon-musk-parentin... http://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/relationship-issues/millionaire-starter-wife http://www.marieclaire.com/sex-love/relationship-issues/mill... he definitely falls into the creep class in my book. I hope neither of my daughters ever gets into a relationship with someone who shares his worldview and says stuff like "if you were my employee I would fire you" to them. Or asking where he can find a new girlfriend that can fit into a 10 hour per week time budget. What a cad. Then there are the kids. The kids he admits he doesn't spend enough time with (and even then says he can be a great dad spending time with them while simultaneously working. Multitasking for the win!) and who have been through the divorce. Again, just my own biases and take on the world that I am sure aren't shared by all, but I can categorically say that every single person I know whose parents divorced when they were young has resulting damage they carry to this day, into their own marriages and parenting.
- jack-r-abbit 13y ago
  To be fair, two of those links are told from the point of view of his ex-wife. The world is full of people that have rather harsh things to say about their exes. Some of it is true.
- pekk 13y ago
  Choosing a demanding career and suffering a divorce - what a misogynistic cad.

vezzy-fnord 13y ago

The problem is that you probably have some sort of unrealistic godlike caricature of who he is. He's an extremely idealistic, prolific and successful startup founder. Whether he is the "savior of humanity" is a different topic, although plenty do tend to exaggerate. It's largely because ambitious founders project their hopes and dreams onto him and revere him. Which is a normal psychological occurrence, but also emotionally driven. Musk is a fallible human like anyone else. Why should his misogyny (can you back that up by the way, I'm not aware?) deflect from his business endeavors? The thing is you'll always disagree with people on certain things. It seems to me like you're trying too hard to find something to get offended over. I enjoy the works of plenty of people whom I ideologically disagree with, but it poses no grievance to me. Separate the actor from the act.

patja 13y ago
I like his work and his ideas and what he is accomplishing. And I am certain my approval or disapproval for his character matters not a bit to anything external to myself. Given how he expresses himself and his pattern of prioritizing those nominally closest to himself, I just don't like the idea of Musk attaining a role model status, a direction his celebrity seems to point towards.

benched 13y ago

Oh please. I'm really sure this is completely based in fact, and doesn't involve anybody being oversensitive, judgmental, or self-righteous.

jack-r-abbit 13y ago

I think many would say that about Steve Jobs. You don't have to be a good person to do good things.

VeejayRampay 13y ago
s/do good things/be rich and successful/