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We have to be careful here, while I am all for Tesla being able to sell their cars where they want I want assurances I can get their car and any other car servi

We have to be careful here, while I am all for Tesla being able to sell their cars where they want I want assurances I can get their car and any other car serviced where I want. Car dealers and independent auto service centers need protection from manufactures; dealers can service brands they don't sell should they choose. The danger in allowing manufacturers to determine how sales are made is they will likely dictate how repair and maintenance is handled. While maintenance on an electronic vehicle is going to be significantly different my warranty should not be affected should I choose someone other than the manufacturer to repair it. disclaimer, I work for a leading supplier of auto parts.

gergles 13y ago
Magnusson-Moss already prevents manufacturers from denying your warranty based on who does the service. We don't need protectionism for the dealerships.
- schiffern 13y ago
  Yep, but it doesn't prevent them from requiring proprietary equipment, scan tools, service manuals, and part ordering systems that only dealers can buy. This is why Right to Repair laws are so important. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Vehicle_Owners%27_Right_to_Repair_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Vehicle_Owners%27_Right_...
hueving 13y ago
>We have to be careful here, while I am all for Tesla being able to sell their cars where they want I want assurances I can get their car and any other car serviced where I want. Those are two completely separate topics. The fact that dealers now service cars has nothing to do with the fact that they sell them. Otherwise auto repair shops wouldn't exist.
300bps 13y ago
The danger in allowing manufacturers to determine how sales are made is they will likely dictate how repair and maintenance is handled. With Tesla, I don't think it is anywhere near as likely as you seem to. Look at this: http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/people-new-jersey http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/people-new-jersey Going a step further, I have made it a principle within Tesla that we should never attempt to make servicing a profit center. It does not seem right to me that companies try to make a profit off customers when their product breaks. Overcharging people for unneeded servicing (often not even fixing the original problem) is rampant within the industry and happened to me personally on several occasions when I drove gasoline cars. Beyond that, with unbelievably fewer moving parts and over-the-air updates, Tesla vehicles require far less servicing. For starters, they don't require regular oil changes.
- mikeash 13y ago
  Regarding your last paragraph, I believe the only item that requires routine service is the tires.
  - toomuchtodo 13y ago
    And wiper blades. The brake pads should go ~100K miles between replacement.
  - mikestew 13y ago
    If there's a published service schedule, I can't find it. But it's probably safe to guess it's much like the Nissan Leaf. The Tesla probably has a teensy cooling system for the motor (they do get hot). Probably has an in-cabin air filter. Brake fluid, most assuredly. It might have a bit of oil in the thingy that transfers electric motor power to axles, or maybe it doesn't have that thingy. None of which really needs to touched very often. Brake fluid should be changed once a year or so (yeah, neither do I). Same with the in-cabin filter. The rest is a 100K mile service on the Leaf, IIRC.
baddox 13y ago
> The danger in allowing manufacturers to determine how sales are made is they will likely dictate how repair and maintenance is handled. That danger only applies to you if you don't read the contract agreement before signing it.
- dangrossman 13y ago
  If there exists no other place to obtain replacement parts, firmware/software necessary to run the car, and diagnostic equipment that can check trouble codes and such, then what agreements you've signed is irrelevant. It's of no benefit that you're allowed to bring your car to Pep Boys instead of Tesla if Tesla doesn't provide Pep Boys with the parts and information they'd need to actually repair your car.
  - baddox 13y ago
    That's a fair point. One would need to put more effort into researching the manufacturer.
  - michaelfeathers 13y ago
    How is this different from Dell or Apple?
    - deleted 13y ago
      [deleted]
    - wmeredith 13y ago
      I didn't pay $30k for my iPhone.
wmeredith 13y ago
There are tons of service shops that don't sell cars. In fact, having worked in that industry for a while and as a gear for over a decade, I'd say if you want to get some of the worst car service around, head straight to your dealer. Otherwise, find a local independent mechanic.

gergles 13y ago

Magnusson-Moss already prevents manufacturers from denying your warranty based on who does the service. We don't need protectionism for the dealerships.

schiffern 13y ago
Yep, but it doesn't prevent them from requiring proprietary equipment, scan tools, service manuals, and part ordering systems that only dealers can buy. This is why Right to Repair laws are so important. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Vehicle_Owners%27_Right_to_Repair_Act https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motor_Vehicle_Owners%27_Right_...

hueving 13y ago

>We have to be careful here, while I am all for Tesla being able to sell their cars where they want I want assurances I can get their car and any other car serviced where I want. Those are two completely separate topics. The fact that dealers now service cars has nothing to do with the fact that they sell them. Otherwise auto repair shops wouldn't exist.

300bps 13y ago

The danger in allowing manufacturers to determine how sales are made is they will likely dictate how repair and maintenance is handled. With Tesla, I don't think it is anywhere near as likely as you seem to. Look at this: http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/people-new-jersey http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/people-new-jersey Going a step further, I have made it a principle within Tesla that we should never attempt to make servicing a profit center. It does not seem right to me that companies try to make a profit off customers when their product breaks. Overcharging people for unneeded servicing (often not even fixing the original problem) is rampant within the industry and happened to me personally on several occasions when I drove gasoline cars. Beyond that, with unbelievably fewer moving parts and over-the-air updates, Tesla vehicles require far less servicing. For starters, they don't require regular oil changes.

mikeash 13y ago
Regarding your last paragraph, I believe the only item that requires routine service is the tires.
- toomuchtodo 13y ago
  And wiper blades. The brake pads should go ~100K miles between replacement.
- mikestew 13y ago
  If there's a published service schedule, I can't find it. But it's probably safe to guess it's much like the Nissan Leaf. The Tesla probably has a teensy cooling system for the motor (they do get hot). Probably has an in-cabin air filter. Brake fluid, most assuredly. It might have a bit of oil in the thingy that transfers electric motor power to axles, or maybe it doesn't have that thingy. None of which really needs to touched very often. Brake fluid should be changed once a year or so (yeah, neither do I). Same with the in-cabin filter. The rest is a 100K mile service on the Leaf, IIRC.

baddox 13y ago

> The danger in allowing manufacturers to determine how sales are made is they will likely dictate how repair and maintenance is handled. That danger only applies to you if you don't read the contract agreement before signing it.

dangrossman 13y ago
If there exists no other place to obtain replacement parts, firmware/software necessary to run the car, and diagnostic equipment that can check trouble codes and such, then what agreements you've signed is irrelevant. It's of no benefit that you're allowed to bring your car to Pep Boys instead of Tesla if Tesla doesn't provide Pep Boys with the parts and information they'd need to actually repair your car.
- baddox 13y ago
  That's a fair point. One would need to put more effort into researching the manufacturer.
- michaelfeathers 13y ago
  How is this different from Dell or Apple?
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
  - wmeredith 13y ago
    I didn't pay $30k for my iPhone.

wmeredith 13y ago

There are tons of service shops that don't sell cars. In fact, having worked in that industry for a while and as a gear for over a decade, I'd say if you want to get some of the worst car service around, head straight to your dealer. Otherwise, find a local independent mechanic.