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I don't know how to make it more clear that I wasn't actually referring to any specific "cool kids" and that my statement was not intended to be taken literally

I don't know how to make it more clear that I wasn't actually referring to any specific "cool kids" and that my statement was not intended to be taken literally. Claim: for any given period of the hacker scene, saying it largely amounted to nothing more than things like carding and harassment is false, and this statement would only be made by someone who either: (a) was not exposed, or exposed only to a poor sample, and therefore doesn't understand the culture (ignorance); or (b) was exposed, but intentionally wishes to misrepresent the situation (dishonesty) So I guess the possibilities are either that your statement was ignorant, dishonest, or my claim is wrong and the hacker scene (during whatever time period you intended) was in fact nothing more than dishonorable carders and trolls. If nothing else, you must know that rming a compromised unix box was not the norm.

tptacek 13y ago
No, I know you to be wrong about that. It's also worth remembering that many of the smartest people in the '90s hack scene came from the virus scene. What I don't understand is how someone who was around in the 90s could manage to mythologize a bunch of teenagers using semicolons and pipe filters to pop shells on boxes and dump mail spools. Here's the part where you tell me that you once knew a hacker who never rm'd a box. Why am I meant to care about that? There was zero correlation in the 90s between skill and care for other people's data. Your opening comment was, "sounds like someone wasn't in the cool kids group". Now you've moved the goalposts; turns out you weren't talking about the "cool kids" at all. But it doesn't matter whether we're talking specifics or the broader issue of whether hackers were more or less moral in the 1990s: you're comprehensively wrong. Consider resetting the "tptacek is always full of shit" bit that is obviously stuck in your brain.

tptacek 13y ago

No, I know you to be wrong about that. It's also worth remembering that many of the smartest people in the '90s hack scene came from the virus scene. What I don't understand is how someone who was around in the 90s could manage to mythologize a bunch of teenagers using semicolons and pipe filters to pop shells on boxes and dump mail spools. Here's the part where you tell me that you once knew a hacker who never rm'd a box. Why am I meant to care about that? There was zero correlation in the 90s between skill and care for other people's data. Your opening comment was, "sounds like someone wasn't in the cool kids group". Now you've moved the goalposts; turns out you weren't talking about the "cool kids" at all. But it doesn't matter whether we're talking specifics or the broader issue of whether hackers were more or less moral in the 1990s: you're comprehensively wrong. Consider resetting the "tptacek is always full of shit" bit that is obviously stuck in your brain.