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#2 isn't viable because it breaks the primary design goal and the entire purpose of Keynote '13--that every presentation opens the same way across desktop, web,

#2 isn't viable because it breaks the primary design goal and the entire purpose of Keynote '13--that every presentation opens the same way across desktop, web, and mobile. The Keynote '09 source code does not and never has compiled for ARM, and so you would be faced with exactly the same dialog you have now, except instead of on your Mac it's on your iPad and instead of asking you to find an old version of keynote it asks you to find a Mac. The great thing about #1 is that if Apple really did leave money on the table here, any third-party developer can collect it. Just put a Mac with two versions of keynote behind a REST endpoint and charge a buck or two per conversion. If you can turn a profit at that, not only do you get the smug satisfaction of clearly winning an internet argument, but also there's a cash prize. If, however, that sounds like a waste of a perfectly good weekend, an economic bet that is unlikely to pay off, it would be an equal waste of a weekend for an Apple engineer. Apple is not a charity; they are a business that takes calculated risks, and they didn't like this one. Did they miscalculate? If you think so, there is no reason not to fill the gap yourself.

tlrobinson 13y ago
Somehow Apple has been able to port their entire operating system from PPC to Intel to ARM. I think they could manage porting a bit of iWork code.
- 001sky 13y ago
  exactly... they friggin switched CPUs
  - acqq 13y ago
    Two times! 1994 -- switch from Motorola to PowerPC. 2006 -- switch from PowerPC to Intel
- stefan_kendall3 13y ago
  It's not about 'can they'. It's about 'should they'. Can I build a flappy bird clone? Sure. Should I? Hell no. I have more profitable projects to work on given a fixed amount of time and resources. If you think this is money left on the table, then build the 'small utility' to convert the format yourself. If you make money, huzzah, you were right. If you don't, then you were wrong, and this is a niche use case that isn't worth the investment.
chris_wot 13y ago
You must be joking. The amount of time that it takes a consumer to build a product is not the same amount of time a paid developer uses to build a software product, and take it through a QA process. It's ridiculous that you cannot open the previous version of a Pages file in the current version of Pages! What an absolute joke.
- fredsted 13y ago
  When I upgraded my iWorks to '13, it put the old versions in a folder. I can still access Pages '09, Keynote '09, etc. Did OP delete those old versions? I don't see what the problem is here.
  - gpvos 13y ago
    > I do have an installation CD, but I don’t have a CD drive any more. He got a new machine.
    - AnthonyMouse 13y ago
      The lack of CD drive has several not very difficult solutions: Get a USB CD drive, use your old computer or a friend's computer make a dmg out of the CD, etc.
      - stefanu 13y ago
        It's about the principle. I'm not saying that the problem has no solution, I can convert the files using someone else's computer as you are saying. Why should I get a USB CD drive that I will use only to convert documents that I expect to be readable anyways? Why should I spend time looking for someone with iWork'09 installation and use their time to convert my documents? It is just unacceptable from a company that is proud for user experience of its products. I should be able to do that from my chair, legally, with a download of a conversion tool or with an upload to a conversion service from Apple, not a third-party. I would not mind buying a floppy drive and all necessary adapters, install Atari ST emulator and write Kamenicky encoding converter in Python to convert 1st World Plus documents from '89 if I had to convert documents of my parents. I would not be complaining about obsolescence of the format at all. My problem is not technical, it is about user experience and productivity.
jasonlotito 13y ago
> #2 isn't viable because it breaks the primary design goal and the entire purpose of Keynote '13--that every presentation opens the same way across desktop, web, and mobile. Except, right now, it doesn't. If that was their primary design goal, than it has not been achieved, because their web version still lacks features that are front and center on the desktop. So, you can't use that as an excuse.
hughw 13y ago
> Just put a Mac with two versions of keynote behind a REST endpoint and charge a buck or two per conversion That would violate the Keynote license agreement. So, we're back to needing Apple to help out here. edit: from Section 2A, Permitted License Uses and Restrictions... i) to download, install, use and run for personal, non-commercial use, one (1) copy of the Apple Software directly on each Apple-branded computer running OS X (“Mac Computer”) that you own or control; and (ii) if you are a commercial enterprise or educational institution, to download, install, use and run one (1) copy of the Apple Software for use either: (a) by a single individual on each of the Mac Computer(s) that you own or control, or (b) by multiple individuals on a single shared Mac Computer that you own or control. For example, a single employee may use the Apple Software on both the employee’s desktop Mac Computer and laptop Mac Computer, or multiple students may serially use the Apple Software on a single Mac Computer located at a resource center or library.
- chc 13y ago
  > if you are a commercial enterprise or educational institution, to download, install, use and run one (1) copy of the Apple Software for use … by multiple individuals on a single shared Mac Computer that you own or control. For example, … multiple students may serially use the Apple Software on a single Mac Computer located at a resource center or library. Doesn't that cover the suggested use?
hughw 13y ago
It's not charity to support your old versions. It's customer retention.

tlrobinson 13y ago

Somehow Apple has been able to port their entire operating system from PPC to Intel to ARM. I think they could manage porting a bit of iWork code.

001sky 13y ago
exactly... they friggin switched CPUs
- acqq 13y ago
  Two times! 1994 -- switch from Motorola to PowerPC. 2006 -- switch from PowerPC to Intel
stefan_kendall3 13y ago
It's not about 'can they'. It's about 'should they'. Can I build a flappy bird clone? Sure. Should I? Hell no. I have more profitable projects to work on given a fixed amount of time and resources. If you think this is money left on the table, then build the 'small utility' to convert the format yourself. If you make money, huzzah, you were right. If you don't, then you were wrong, and this is a niche use case that isn't worth the investment.

chris_wot 13y ago

You must be joking. The amount of time that it takes a consumer to build a product is not the same amount of time a paid developer uses to build a software product, and take it through a QA process. It's ridiculous that you cannot open the previous version of a Pages file in the current version of Pages! What an absolute joke.

fredsted 13y ago
When I upgraded my iWorks to '13, it put the old versions in a folder. I can still access Pages '09, Keynote '09, etc. Did OP delete those old versions? I don't see what the problem is here.
- gpvos 13y ago
  > I do have an installation CD, but I don’t have a CD drive any more. He got a new machine.
  - AnthonyMouse 13y ago
    The lack of CD drive has several not very difficult solutions: Get a USB CD drive, use your old computer or a friend's computer make a dmg out of the CD, etc.
    - stefanu 13y ago
      It's about the principle. I'm not saying that the problem has no solution, I can convert the files using someone else's computer as you are saying. Why should I get a USB CD drive that I will use only to convert documents that I expect to be readable anyways? Why should I spend time looking for someone with iWork'09 installation and use their time to convert my documents? It is just unacceptable from a company that is proud for user experience of its products. I should be able to do that from my chair, legally, with a download of a conversion tool or with an upload to a conversion service from Apple, not a third-party. I would not mind buying a floppy drive and all necessary adapters, install Atari ST emulator and write Kamenicky encoding converter in Python to convert 1st World Plus documents from '89 if I had to convert documents of my parents. I would not be complaining about obsolescence of the format at all. My problem is not technical, it is about user experience and productivity.

jasonlotito 13y ago

> #2 isn't viable because it breaks the primary design goal and the entire purpose of Keynote '13--that every presentation opens the same way across desktop, web, and mobile. Except, right now, it doesn't. If that was their primary design goal, than it has not been achieved, because their web version still lacks features that are front and center on the desktop. So, you can't use that as an excuse.

hughw 13y ago

> Just put a Mac with two versions of keynote behind a REST endpoint and charge a buck or two per conversion That would violate the Keynote license agreement. So, we're back to needing Apple to help out here. edit: from Section 2A, Permitted License Uses and Restrictions... i) to download, install, use and run for personal, non-commercial use, one (1) copy of the Apple Software directly on each Apple-branded computer running OS X (“Mac Computer”) that you own or control; and (ii) if you are a commercial enterprise or educational institution, to download, install, use and run one (1) copy of the Apple Software for use either: (a) by a single individual on each of the Mac Computer(s) that you own or control, or (b) by multiple individuals on a single shared Mac Computer that you own or control. For example, a single employee may use the Apple Software on both the employee’s desktop Mac Computer and laptop Mac Computer, or multiple students may serially use the Apple Software on a single Mac Computer located at a resource center or library.

chc 13y ago
> if you are a commercial enterprise or educational institution, to download, install, use and run one (1) copy of the Apple Software for use … by multiple individuals on a single shared Mac Computer that you own or control. For example, … multiple students may serially use the Apple Software on a single Mac Computer located at a resource center or library. Doesn't that cover the suggested use?

hughw 13y ago

It's not charity to support your old versions. It's customer retention.