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"Boundaries in digital space will come to resemble boundaries in real space." God I hope not! There's very little reason that one should reflect the other.

harryh 13y ago
So would you mind handing over your email password so I can go snooping around for a while? I'm not malicious and I won't delete or steal anything. I'd just like to read your private correspondence.
- nitrogen 13y ago
  A lot of different points of view are being conflated in this thread. Some commenters refer to a culture of tinkering and curiosity, while others think they're talking about a culture of disrespect. One comment mentions digital boundaries matching physical ones, a response decries this notion without arguing against boundaries at all, and you respond flippantly with the assumption that the parent comment doesn't want any boundaries at all Those pushing for the preservation and promotion of "hacker culture" are really advocating a cooperative society over an adversarial one. They want us to be motivated by discovery and collective interest, not by a dog-eat-dog sense of protectionism and enemies. Those who argue against a parity between digital and physical borders are fighting a balkanization of the Internet (and thus common society) along entrenched ideological and national lines. They aren't saying that there should be no boundaries, only that the boundaries shouldn't be arbitrarily chosen to match the status quo in the physical world.
  - rayiner 13y ago
    There is nothing "cooperative" about accessing someone's network against their wishes. Indeed, it's anti-cooperative as well as disrespectful. The issue, fundamentally, isn't whether digital boundaries are drawn along the same lines as physical ones. They transcend physical boundaries. The issue is whether we give the same deference to digital boundaries as to physical ones. I.e. whether we treat kids hacking into AT&T's network just for shits and giggles the same as their breaking into AT&T's corporate offices with no particular malintent in mind.
    - nitrogen 13y ago
      I.e. whether we treat kids hacking into AT&T's network just for shits and giggles the same as their breaking into AT&T's corporate offices with no particular malintent in mind. It seems to me that, right now, we treat the digital equivalent far more harshly.
    - angersock 13y ago
      Well, look at it from the historical point of view: Jobs and Woz made their early money doing exactly that, building and selling blue boxes. If you want to encourage people to learn, they have to be able to explore. To explore, they have to be able to conduct some minor mischief from time to time, if for no other reason than mischief is often what evolves into innovation. I don't understand why you are so conservative and, well, stuffy about this.

harryh 13y ago

So would you mind handing over your email password so I can go snooping around for a while? I'm not malicious and I won't delete or steal anything. I'd just like to read your private correspondence.

nitrogen 13y ago
A lot of different points of view are being conflated in this thread. Some commenters refer to a culture of tinkering and curiosity, while others think they're talking about a culture of disrespect. One comment mentions digital boundaries matching physical ones, a response decries this notion without arguing against boundaries at all, and you respond flippantly with the assumption that the parent comment doesn't want any boundaries at all Those pushing for the preservation and promotion of "hacker culture" are really advocating a cooperative society over an adversarial one. They want us to be motivated by discovery and collective interest, not by a dog-eat-dog sense of protectionism and enemies. Those who argue against a parity between digital and physical borders are fighting a balkanization of the Internet (and thus common society) along entrenched ideological and national lines. They aren't saying that there should be no boundaries, only that the boundaries shouldn't be arbitrarily chosen to match the status quo in the physical world.
- rayiner 13y ago
  There is nothing "cooperative" about accessing someone's network against their wishes. Indeed, it's anti-cooperative as well as disrespectful. The issue, fundamentally, isn't whether digital boundaries are drawn along the same lines as physical ones. They transcend physical boundaries. The issue is whether we give the same deference to digital boundaries as to physical ones. I.e. whether we treat kids hacking into AT&T's network just for shits and giggles the same as their breaking into AT&T's corporate offices with no particular malintent in mind.
  - nitrogen 13y ago
    I.e. whether we treat kids hacking into AT&T's network just for shits and giggles the same as their breaking into AT&T's corporate offices with no particular malintent in mind. It seems to me that, right now, we treat the digital equivalent far more harshly.
  - angersock 13y ago
    Well, look at it from the historical point of view: Jobs and Woz made their early money doing exactly that, building and selling blue boxes. If you want to encourage people to learn, they have to be able to explore. To explore, they have to be able to conduct some minor mischief from time to time, if for no other reason than mischief is often what evolves into innovation. I don't understand why you are so conservative and, well, stuffy about this.