5 ms·

The last time I was in NJ, the full-service gas there was the same price as the self-serve in suburban NY. Maybe that's changed, but given the hug number of co

The last time I was in NJ, the full-service gas there was the same price as the self-serve in suburban NY. Maybe that's changed, but given the hug number of commuters in NJ, I conclude it likely that holy hell would have been raised of full-serve was significantly more expensive.

oh_sigh 13y ago
States impose different taxes on their gas. Presumably if NJ allowed self-pump, those prices would be slightly lower. However, in the grand scheme of things, the eliminating the payroll costs from the gas price in NJ would barely have any impact. At a normal gas station which is neither busy nor desolate, an attendant may be able to serve, let's say, 30 cars an hour. If they each get $20 worth of gas, and the total cost of the employee per hour is $20, then the prices would go down only a fraction of a percent if he was eliminated.
- andymcsherry 13y ago
  $20 / ($20 * 30) = 3.3%
  - oh_sigh 13y ago
    Woops! I downgraded my estimates and never updated my text :(
- joesmo 13y ago
  This doesn't take into account the missed sales when stations are closed, nor the cost to the community of having police officers police this (yes, they do even though the pumps shut off automatically).
Bluestrike2 13y ago
Those low prices are largely because NJ has some of the lowest gas taxes in the country (48th) whereas NY has the highest.
- mpyne 13y ago
  Additionally many U.S. oil refineries are right in NJ so they don't have to pay anywhere near the logistical costs that other states have to.
the_ancient 13y ago
last time a saw a full service station I was 5 years old Get out a pump your own damn gas.... jeeze
- dmarkow 13y ago
  It's the same in Oregon. You're not allowed to pump your own gas even if you want to.
  - kabdib 13y ago
    Unless you're on a motorcycle. Then none of the attendants want to deal with you -- they hand you the gas pump nozzle and you do the filling. I don't know what the party line is to justify the gas attendant rules. If it's "consumer safety" then it's bullshit.
    - JoshTriplett 13y ago
      > I don't know what the party line is to justify the gas attendant rules. Blatant employment protectionism. Every time it comes up on a ballot the "statement in favor" is always primarily employment protectionism. The arguments are generally of the form "if we allowed self service, nobody would pay for full service, and those jobs would go away". As with many similarly obnoxious laws: Portland votes for it, the rest of Oregon votes against it, and Portland wins.
      - Crito 13y ago
        Who actually lobbies for it? I can't imagine that gas station attendants themselves have much sway, and I don't see why station owners would want to keep it that way. Is it just regular old people in Portland who honestly believe it is best, even without any lobbying or propaganda?
        repsilat 13y ago
        People aren't smart. They like full-service, and they know it'd disappear if it wasn't the law. What they don't realise is that the reason it'd disappear is that they don't like it enough to pay extra for it. The stations themselves might not be against full-service, either (at least away from state borders.) It's an extra cost, true, but it's paid by all of their competitors, too, so it just drives prices up. Demand is pretty inelastic, so profits aren't much affected. This might change with electric and fuel-efficient cars becoming more common, but it's hard to think long-term when you're selling oil.

oh_sigh 13y ago

States impose different taxes on their gas. Presumably if NJ allowed self-pump, those prices would be slightly lower. However, in the grand scheme of things, the eliminating the payroll costs from the gas price in NJ would barely have any impact. At a normal gas station which is neither busy nor desolate, an attendant may be able to serve, let's say, 30 cars an hour. If they each get $20 worth of gas, and the total cost of the employee per hour is $20, then the prices would go down only a fraction of a percent if he was eliminated.

andymcsherry 13y ago
$20 / ($20 * 30) = 3.3%
- oh_sigh 13y ago
  Woops! I downgraded my estimates and never updated my text :(
joesmo 13y ago
This doesn't take into account the missed sales when stations are closed, nor the cost to the community of having police officers police this (yes, they do even though the pumps shut off automatically).

Bluestrike2 13y ago

Those low prices are largely because NJ has some of the lowest gas taxes in the country (48th) whereas NY has the highest.

mpyne 13y ago
Additionally many U.S. oil refineries are right in NJ so they don't have to pay anywhere near the logistical costs that other states have to.

the_ancient 13y ago

last time a saw a full service station I was 5 years old Get out a pump your own damn gas.... jeeze

dmarkow 13y ago
It's the same in Oregon. You're not allowed to pump your own gas even if you want to.
- kabdib 13y ago
  Unless you're on a motorcycle. Then none of the attendants want to deal with you -- they hand you the gas pump nozzle and you do the filling. I don't know what the party line is to justify the gas attendant rules. If it's "consumer safety" then it's bullshit.
  - JoshTriplett 13y ago
    > I don't know what the party line is to justify the gas attendant rules. Blatant employment protectionism. Every time it comes up on a ballot the "statement in favor" is always primarily employment protectionism. The arguments are generally of the form "if we allowed self service, nobody would pay for full service, and those jobs would go away". As with many similarly obnoxious laws: Portland votes for it, the rest of Oregon votes against it, and Portland wins.
    - Crito 13y ago
      Who actually lobbies for it? I can't imagine that gas station attendants themselves have much sway, and I don't see why station owners would want to keep it that way. Is it just regular old people in Portland who honestly believe it is best, even without any lobbying or propaganda?
      - repsilat 13y ago
        People aren't smart. They like full-service, and they know it'd disappear if it wasn't the law. What they don't realise is that the reason it'd disappear is that they don't like it enough to pay extra for it. The stations themselves might not be against full-service, either (at least away from state borders.) It's an extra cost, true, but it's paid by all of their competitors, too, so it just drives prices up. Demand is pretty inelastic, so profits aren't much affected. This might change with electric and fuel-efficient cars becoming more common, but it's hard to think long-term when you're selling oil.