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For one thing, an OTA update mechanism is obviously more subject to third-party spoofing than an update delivered by physical ethernet from the dealership. (BT
by rst 13y ago
For one thing, an OTA update mechanism is obviously more subject to third-party spoofing than an update delivered by physical ethernet from the dealership.
(BTW, do Teslas apply OTA updates while the car is underway, or store them up for application when parked? If the former, then applying even a correct update to a car in motion could have all sorts of nasty consequences if it resulted in a sudden change to, say, response characteristics of the suspension or brakes.)
- peeters 13y agoIs that true though? I mean, in my mind OTA makes it a given that the firmware is going to be fully signed and the channel will be fully authenticated. Whereas if a dealer is installing it, they could dismiss concerns with "we trust our service technicians." Seems the latter opens the door to a lot of social engineering possibilities. But I was responding to a claim of the update being "poorly tested", not insecure. That's orthogonal to it being over the air. A poorly tested update delivered through a service center can also brick your car.
- GauntletWizard 13y agoI'm sorry, but no. No, most manufacturers update processes aren't actually secure in any meaningful way. Tesla's OTA process seems to use (I've not checked it myself) web standards, encryption, and signatures to verify that the OTA update is correct. The "Physical ethernet cable" that is used by traditional manufacturers can be done by any hobo on the street, in pretty much the same time. It's really only a matter of time before a script-kiddie-ready device that you plug-in and starts the car shows up; There's no security, no signature verification, etc. on the traditional manufacturers updates.
- oh_sigh 13y agoSource please regarding teslas OTA process.
- secabeen 13y agoHere's a pretty good summary from someone who sniffed the WiFi traffic from a Tesla doing an OTA update: http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/22294-Sniffing-the-WiFi-traffic http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/showthread.php/22294-Sniffing...
- hrayr 13y ago"do Teslas apply OTA updates while the car is underway" Even your cellphone doesn't update when it's 'under way', what makes you wonder a moving automobile will? If you hazard a guess as to how OTA's are applied to automobiles, I would guess it'll be in Parked, plugged in, and prompted to update by pressing an "Accept & Update" button.
- stcredzero 13y agoThere are realtime kernels that can update the apps, the OS, and install a new kernel without dropping a beat. VisualWorks Smalltalk had a system for loading code into a shadow of the running class hierarchy, then atomically committing the code changes. If you defined some functions for the transformation of existing objects, you could start a transaction in one version, then finish it in another. We keep forgetting that lots of "advanced" features were actually invented decades ago.
- deleted 13y ago[deleted]
- mikecarlton 13y agoNo, of course it does not apply the update while under way. When there's a firmware update available you get a nice big dialog box telling you so and button that says "would you like install tonight at [3 AM]". You can change the time or even cancel the update. Furthermore, the message tells you it won't install unless the car is plugged in or has a certain level of charge.