3 ms·

Ugh. The message I got was even if a woman has a PhD she can still be reduced to a visual spectacle. I feel sorry for the women in my lab who constantly face th

by cup 13y ago

Ugh. The message I got was even if a woman has a PhD she can still be reduced to a visual spectacle. I feel sorry for the women in my lab who constantly face these pressures. I mean could you ever imagine a fashion line modelling male PhD students? If not why not? Is it because we men can be judged based on the merit of our work and don't have to worry about our appearance? I don't know, maybe I'm reading this wrong.

sirclueless 13y ago
> I mean could you ever imagine a fashion line modelling male PhD students? Yes, I very well could imagine this. Geek chic is very much a thing and this would probably play just fine. I think about this the opposite way from you: Why should having a PhD change the pressures one faces around fashionability and body image? Are you suggesting that people with PhDs have earned the right to be exempt from social pressure by virtue of succeeding in a graduate program? Choosing some arbitrary and largely fashion-orthogonal dimension to slice up the population seems like a very reasonable way to try and advertise fashion to a wider audience. If you are decrying that the media is pigeonholing women as being more fashion-sensitive, or that they are cherry-picking some expected body type out of their chosen demographic, then that is a separate and perhaps valid issue. But I don't read this as having any bearing on the value of a PhD, except as a way to market to an audience that cares about intelligence.
rayiner 13y ago
The luxury of being a man is that you can be rich enough (or smart enough, etc) that it doesn't matter if you're attractive. I'm not just talking about potential dating partners. Just compare the comments people make about Hilary Clinton's looks versus any male politician. Being attractive is a nice bonus for a man, but our society treats it as an absolute requirement for a woman.
return0 13y ago
Agree, only women without bachelor degrees should be allowed to be photographed wearing clothes in order to sell said clothes. PhD is supposed to make you ugly and unpresentable, shielding you from the evil eyes of other women who want to buy clothes. As for me, i only buy jeans that are worn by people with at least 3 PhDs. They make me smarter.
lolwutf 13y ago
What, so your utopian world is an asexual, sexuality-less and sexualization-less world? Do you think that's a realistic expectation for all of society? Much less an enjoyable one? I, for one, thought this calendar came out very tasteful, while still maintaining a feminine (even a 'strong female') message. Nobody is 'reduced' and these aren't girls in bikinis. Loosen up a little and have a more moderate viewpoint. Spoiler - Men (nay, everyone) are judged on their appearances in every facet of life. Look at the numbers: tall and traditionally beautiful people, on average, go further in life, purely based on their appearances. It's just human nature. But we can be a more evolved and sophisticated society by balancing our urges with an appreciation of objective metrics, not looks.
tzs 13y ago
> I mean could you ever imagine a fashion line modelling male PhD students? Yeah, that would be ridiculous. The only thing I can imagine more unlikely would be something like, say, the world chess champion as a fashion model. [1] [2] [3] [1] http://en.chessbase.com/post/magnus-carlsen-s-new-career-fashion-model- http://en.chessbase.com/post/magnus-carlsen-s-new-career-fas... [2] https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.282813624995.33321.244897739995 https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.282813624995.33321... [3] http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2562821/Magnus-Carlsen-joins-Lily-Cole-G-Star-Raw-ad-campaign-inspired-chess.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2562821/Magnus-Car...

by cup 13y ago

sirclueless 13y ago

> I mean could you ever imagine a fashion line modelling male PhD students? Yes, I very well could imagine this. Geek chic is very much a thing and this would probably play just fine. I think about this the opposite way from you: Why should having a PhD change the pressures one faces around fashionability and body image? Are you suggesting that people with PhDs have earned the right to be exempt from social pressure by virtue of succeeding in a graduate program? Choosing some arbitrary and largely fashion-orthogonal dimension to slice up the population seems like a very reasonable way to try and advertise fashion to a wider audience. If you are decrying that the media is pigeonholing women as being more fashion-sensitive, or that they are cherry-picking some expected body type out of their chosen demographic, then that is a separate and perhaps valid issue. But I don't read this as having any bearing on the value of a PhD, except as a way to market to an audience that cares about intelligence.

rayiner 13y ago

The luxury of being a man is that you can be rich enough (or smart enough, etc) that it doesn't matter if you're attractive. I'm not just talking about potential dating partners. Just compare the comments people make about Hilary Clinton's looks versus any male politician. Being attractive is a nice bonus for a man, but our society treats it as an absolute requirement for a woman.

return0 13y ago

Agree, only women without bachelor degrees should be allowed to be photographed wearing clothes in order to sell said clothes. PhD is supposed to make you ugly and unpresentable, shielding you from the evil eyes of other women who want to buy clothes. As for me, i only buy jeans that are worn by people with at least 3 PhDs. They make me smarter.

lolwutf 13y ago

What, so your utopian world is an asexual, sexuality-less and sexualization-less world? Do you think that's a realistic expectation for all of society? Much less an enjoyable one? I, for one, thought this calendar came out very tasteful, while still maintaining a feminine (even a 'strong female') message. Nobody is 'reduced' and these aren't girls in bikinis. Loosen up a little and have a more moderate viewpoint. Spoiler - Men (nay, everyone) are judged on their appearances in every facet of life. Look at the numbers: tall and traditionally beautiful people, on average, go further in life, purely based on their appearances. It's just human nature. But we can be a more evolved and sophisticated society by balancing our urges with an appreciation of objective metrics, not looks.

tzs 13y ago

> I mean could you ever imagine a fashion line modelling male PhD students? Yeah, that would be ridiculous. The only thing I can imagine more unlikely would be something like, say, the world chess champion as a fashion model. [1] [2] [3] [1] http://en.chessbase.com/post/magnus-carlsen-s-new-career-fashion-model- http://en.chessbase.com/post/magnus-carlsen-s-new-career-fas... [2] https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.282813624995.33321.244897739995 https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.282813624995.33321... [3] http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2562821/Magnus-Carlsen-joins-Lily-Cole-G-Star-Raw-ad-campaign-inspired-chess.html http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2562821/Magnus-Car...