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People are taking out 6 figure loans to be taught not to further a universities research goals.

baq 13y ago
1) where do you think that money goes? 2) if they're paying for stuff they aren't getting, whose problem is it?
gajomi 13y ago
You mean 5 figure loans right? Five figures are quite common (I am paying one off myself) but I think 6 is really quite rare. In any case, with few exceptions tuition money does not get used to conduct any kind of research. Most of it will go towards some combination of paying for administration, facilities, and teaching fees for non-tenured lecturers (in the parlance of the US system). In fact, at most Tier I research institutions research grants are actually subsidizing educational expenses with various mechanisms built in to most awards requiring expenditures to this effect.
snotrockets 13y ago
That's the problem with free markets: in reality, they are rarely (never?) rational. Let me offer a different modeling of academy as a market: The product isn't education, but the improvement of society, both in the near term, by fruits of research, and in the long term, by having more and better educated people around. So the students aren't the clients, but the product; which is paid for mostly in public funds (there is no such thing as privatize research. Almost all significant research has some public sponsored portion -- it's just too expensive to do without). Therefore, some countries even go and make higher education free, or near free. But, one can see you can increase your earnings, by also charging the students, as their graduation not only improve society as a a whole, but gives them personal gain too. So you do that, but it's more like marketing a bi-product, and not a product itself. Further evidence is that almost all PhDs are free to the student, even in the US (or at least, for promising students.) For non-libertarians, the above is a compelling reason for fully subsidizing education.

baq 13y ago

1) where do you think that money goes? 2) if they're paying for stuff they aren't getting, whose problem is it?

You mean 5 figure loans right? Five figures are quite common (I am paying one off myself) but I think 6 is really quite rare. In any case, with few exceptions tuition money does not get used to conduct any kind of research. Most of it will go towards some combination of paying for administration, facilities, and teaching fees for non-tenured lecturers (in the parlance of the US system). In fact, at most Tier I research institutions research grants are actually subsidizing educational expenses with various mechanisms built in to most awards requiring expenditures to this effect.

snotrockets 13y ago

That's the problem with free markets: in reality, they are rarely (never?) rational. Let me offer a different modeling of academy as a market: The product isn't education, but the improvement of society, both in the near term, by fruits of research, and in the long term, by having more and better educated people around. So the students aren't the clients, but the product; which is paid for mostly in public funds (there is no such thing as privatize research. Almost all significant research has some public sponsored portion -- it's just too expensive to do without). Therefore, some countries even go and make higher education free, or near free. But, one can see you can increase your earnings, by also charging the students, as their graduation not only improve society as a a whole, but gives them personal gain too. So you do that, but it's more like marketing a bi-product, and not a product itself. Further evidence is that almost all PhDs are free to the student, even in the US (or at least, for promising students.) For non-libertarians, the above is a compelling reason for fully subsidizing education.