4 ms·

That was a great article - very insightful. A question though : Is it possible to get into YC without having an actual working product? That is with just a gene

by ther1 13y ago

That was a great article - very insightful. A question though : Is it possible to get into YC without having an actual working product? That is with just a general idea for a product that you want to build? The impression I got by reading all the stuff in the tech press, is that almost no one will fund just an idea - even seed funding - you do need to have a working product, and traction and customers, etc. The other question is : Is it possible to get into YC if you are much older than your mid-twenties or early thirties? I know it is theoretically possible - but are there any YC founders in their forties or even fifties?

wellboy 13y ago
It's much different if you're a second time founder (you have sold acompany before) such as Zac's co-founder. If you're a first time founder without significant traction, I think it's very unlikely to get into YC. I can imagine less than 5% of first time founders in the past few years that got into YC didn't have decent traction. Does anyone have numbers on that?
- zt 13y ago
  Woah woah. I've never sold a company before. Dan was the COO of Giftly, which sold.
  - wellboy 13y ago
    Yahh, I was posting the comment just when I looked it up and changed it! ;)
zt 13y ago
It is hard to get in to YC without something, but we didn't have a demo. You can read our whole app at: http://blog.zactownsend.com/our-yc-s13-application http://blog.zactownsend.com/our-yc-s13-application In my YC class, I would say the median age was roughly mine: 28. Any number of founders were in their late 30s and 40s.
- rahimnathwani 13y ago
  Were there any first-time founders in their late 30s and 40s?
  - cfield 13y ago
    I was 39 when we did YC.
outericky 13y ago
Just having an idea is tough. Having a market for that idea, with some interest is better. When we did YC, I was 36. I wasn't the oldest, but it was close. There have been founders in their 40's and even 50's (as far as I know - could be even more). The problem with older founders... your needs are different (financial burdens, children etc) which makes it more difficult to succeed. As a "kid" you are much more likely to live with 6 other people eating ramen and coding 18 hrs a day.
- brettinlj 13y ago
  The problem with older founders... often their needs are different (financial burdens, children etc), though they also often have more life and career experience, which make for a different set of challenges to success. Fixed that for you.
  - johnvschmitt 13y ago
    And, older founders* spend vastly less time & energy chasing tail / finding a mate. *(generally speaking, & speaking of myself)
- akbar501 13y ago
  > The problem with older founders... your needs are different (financial burdens, children etc) which makes it more difficult to succeed. This is an interesting point and one that I've seen multiple people bring up over time on HN. Often as first hand feedback from the person with a family. Financial obligations are more. No doubt. When I started my first company I lived off of a few hundred dollars a month (personally) and put everything else into the company. And your point about "eating ramen" is too true. In my experience, founding a company in my 20's, early 30's and doing one again in my late 30's is that finding a big opportunity is equally hard at any age. I don't see that getting any easier. However, what I do differently now is that that I'm infinitely more disciplined. I talk to customers earlier, I spend less time on building a prototype (6 weeks to 12 weeks max), and am willing to kill an idea as soon as I realize that its not going to get me to my goal. What I'd be interested in seeing are stats on the success of 30+ founders who are on a 2nd/3rd startup vs. 1st time founders who are 30+. My guess is these two groups would diverge widely, but that's just a guess. Importantly, I find some parts of starting a company much easier at this age. First, and perhaps most importantly, my wife and I have committed to the startup lifestyle (not a lifestyle business per say, but to pursuing opportunities to grow our net worth). We openly discuss our goals. We have been together through 2 companies, so we know how much of a pain this one will be. We are in agreement that the costs of building a new company are worth the potential to take us to the next level financially. I find this is where many people think that starting a company after marriage is more difficult. However, I have seen that being married can lighten your load as a founder if you and your spouse agree on who will carry what load. One of my friend's had the same conversation with his wife. She's starting a company, and he's pulling a huge load at home. So the same advice works for both men and women. In terms of distractions, I have way less of them now than when I was younger. Everyone I know is busy with family and kids, so there is little pressure to hang out and waste time. This is totally personal experience/opinion, but kids have been a boon to my startup work. There's no way to explain it except to say that spending time with my daughters is calming. Stress be damned. Maybe its just me, but I find the 20 year olds of today exceptionally capable. I am super impressed with how good the younger generations are. They are focused, motivated, capable. I find this beneficial both because I have now have experience, but there is an entire younger generation who are wonderful to speak with, learn from, and work with. The financial aspects of starting a company now are a world easier. Without diving into detail, its a cake walk now. I don't starve. I know to expect losses on some ideas. I've had enough failures and some successes to know that sometimes ideas and companies fail, and sometimes they succeed. In summary, your point is well taken. It's definitely different.
tlb 13y ago
Most companies are accepted before their product works. But you sound like you haven't even started trying to build it yet. Start building something. Hacking together a crappy prototype always brings surprising insights. Many founders are in their 40s and some are in their 50s.
- ther1 13y ago
  I do have something - but it is not very far along. Was wondering how far along it needs to be - we just have a rough working wireframe and an early prototype, but no customers. The impression I got from the article is that they did not have any/many customers either. So how important is to already have actual paying customers and users.
  - duschang27 13y ago
    We got into YC before we had any customer, so it is possible. But personally, I would recommend that you wait until you have your MVP first. You don't want to spend half of YC building you MVP, since partners can't really help you defining your vision. What they are really good at is helping you optimize it.
ryanSrich 13y ago
> you do need to have a working product, and traction and customers, etc. The best advice I've read is that you need at least one of those things. And it needs to be done very well. Dropbox is the traditional example. IIRC they had a ton of signups and traction before building their product.
- ther1 13y ago
  How did they have tons of signups before they had a product? Did they just have a "coming soon" (with these awesome features) landing page? Would that count as traction?
  - outericky 13y ago
    It's not traction, but it's significant interest.

by ther1 13y ago

wellboy 13y ago

It's much different if you're a second time founder (you have sold acompany before) such as Zac's co-founder. If you're a first time founder without significant traction, I think it's very unlikely to get into YC. I can imagine less than 5% of first time founders in the past few years that got into YC didn't have decent traction. Does anyone have numbers on that?

zt 13y ago
Woah woah. I've never sold a company before. Dan was the COO of Giftly, which sold.
- wellboy 13y ago
  Yahh, I was posting the comment just when I looked it up and changed it! ;)

zt 13y ago

It is hard to get in to YC without something, but we didn't have a demo. You can read our whole app at: http://blog.zactownsend.com/our-yc-s13-application http://blog.zactownsend.com/our-yc-s13-application In my YC class, I would say the median age was roughly mine: 28. Any number of founders were in their late 30s and 40s.

rahimnathwani 13y ago
Were there any first-time founders in their late 30s and 40s?
- cfield 13y ago
  I was 39 when we did YC.

outericky 13y ago

Just having an idea is tough. Having a market for that idea, with some interest is better. When we did YC, I was 36. I wasn't the oldest, but it was close. There have been founders in their 40's and even 50's (as far as I know - could be even more). The problem with older founders... your needs are different (financial burdens, children etc) which makes it more difficult to succeed. As a "kid" you are much more likely to live with 6 other people eating ramen and coding 18 hrs a day.

brettinlj 13y ago
The problem with older founders... often their needs are different (financial burdens, children etc), though they also often have more life and career experience, which make for a different set of challenges to success. Fixed that for you.
- johnvschmitt 13y ago
  And, older founders* spend vastly less time & energy chasing tail / finding a mate. *(generally speaking, & speaking of myself)
akbar501 13y ago
> The problem with older founders... your needs are different (financial burdens, children etc) which makes it more difficult to succeed. This is an interesting point and one that I've seen multiple people bring up over time on HN. Often as first hand feedback from the person with a family. Financial obligations are more. No doubt. When I started my first company I lived off of a few hundred dollars a month (personally) and put everything else into the company. And your point about "eating ramen" is too true. In my experience, founding a company in my 20's, early 30's and doing one again in my late 30's is that finding a big opportunity is equally hard at any age. I don't see that getting any easier. However, what I do differently now is that that I'm infinitely more disciplined. I talk to customers earlier, I spend less time on building a prototype (6 weeks to 12 weeks max), and am willing to kill an idea as soon as I realize that its not going to get me to my goal. What I'd be interested in seeing are stats on the success of 30+ founders who are on a 2nd/3rd startup vs. 1st time founders who are 30+. My guess is these two groups would diverge widely, but that's just a guess. Importantly, I find some parts of starting a company much easier at this age. First, and perhaps most importantly, my wife and I have committed to the startup lifestyle (not a lifestyle business per say, but to pursuing opportunities to grow our net worth). We openly discuss our goals. We have been together through 2 companies, so we know how much of a pain this one will be. We are in agreement that the costs of building a new company are worth the potential to take us to the next level financially. I find this is where many people think that starting a company after marriage is more difficult. However, I have seen that being married can lighten your load as a founder if you and your spouse agree on who will carry what load. One of my friend's had the same conversation with his wife. She's starting a company, and he's pulling a huge load at home. So the same advice works for both men and women. In terms of distractions, I have way less of them now than when I was younger. Everyone I know is busy with family and kids, so there is little pressure to hang out and waste time. This is totally personal experience/opinion, but kids have been a boon to my startup work. There's no way to explain it except to say that spending time with my daughters is calming. Stress be damned. Maybe its just me, but I find the 20 year olds of today exceptionally capable. I am super impressed with how good the younger generations are. They are focused, motivated, capable. I find this beneficial both because I have now have experience, but there is an entire younger generation who are wonderful to speak with, learn from, and work with. The financial aspects of starting a company now are a world easier. Without diving into detail, its a cake walk now. I don't starve. I know to expect losses on some ideas. I've had enough failures and some successes to know that sometimes ideas and companies fail, and sometimes they succeed. In summary, your point is well taken. It's definitely different.

tlb 13y ago

Most companies are accepted before their product works. But you sound like you haven't even started trying to build it yet. Start building something. Hacking together a crappy prototype always brings surprising insights. Many founders are in their 40s and some are in their 50s.

ther1 13y ago
I do have something - but it is not very far along. Was wondering how far along it needs to be - we just have a rough working wireframe and an early prototype, but no customers. The impression I got from the article is that they did not have any/many customers either. So how important is to already have actual paying customers and users.
- duschang27 13y ago
  We got into YC before we had any customer, so it is possible. But personally, I would recommend that you wait until you have your MVP first. You don't want to spend half of YC building you MVP, since partners can't really help you defining your vision. What they are really good at is helping you optimize it.

ryanSrich 13y ago

> you do need to have a working product, and traction and customers, etc. The best advice I've read is that you need at least one of those things. And it needs to be done very well. Dropbox is the traditional example. IIRC they had a ton of signups and traction before building their product.

ther1 13y ago
How did they have tons of signups before they had a product? Did they just have a "coming soon" (with these awesome features) landing page? Would that count as traction?
- outericky 13y ago
  It's not traction, but it's significant interest.