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Even though this advice isn't something she might consider in her current situation, it might be good for her to hear it. After all, she's basically a hostage i

Even though this advice isn't something she might consider in her current situation, it might be good for her to hear it. After all, she's basically a hostage in this situation, and hearing people confirm this might prevent her from getting stuck in a "Stockholm syndrome". And frankly, I think her best move in this situation would be to say no and find refuge for herself. Yes, family members might get seriously injured as a result, but the way I see it there is no other way of breaking free from such an oppressive culture. Everything is set up to lure you back.

tinco 13y ago
You are forgetting that she is in college, and desires to continue to do so. Overtly saying no will most likely result in family or friends of family going after her in Spain. Once you enter the Shengen area of Europe, which is reachable by car from Pakistan you can basically get anywhere. There are countless easily traversed borders to this area in corrupt/poorer countries. After that there's close to no border checks. It is really easy for friends/family to get to Spain and make her life difficult there.
- tinco 13y ago
  Living in The Netherlands it's easy to forget that these countries are not actually separated from Europe in any way. The distance between Amsterdam and Pakistan is comparable (a bit longer) to the distance between L.A. and New York. A cool story that was recently in the Dutch news reduces that perceived distance, when an independent car rental business owner pursues and retrieves one of his cars all the way in Iraq: http://translate.google.nl/translate?sl=nl&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=nl&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fnos.nl%2Fartikel%2F595258-man-naar-irak-om-gestolen-autos.html http://translate.google.nl/translate?sl=nl&tl=en&js=n&prev=_... The thieves just rented a car, and drove there. Possibly to fight Jihad.
  - khuey 13y ago
    Pakistan is much farther away than you think it is. http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=AMS-KHI,+JFK-LAX http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=AMS-KHI,+JFK-LAX
    - tinco 13y ago
      Hmm that's weird, I measured by going to google maps, spreading my fingers between Amsterdam and Pakistan. I then scrolled to the U.S. while holding my fingers in that position, and the distance difference was like ~20%, according to your flightplan it's almost twice as far though. Not sure what went wrong there :) edit: using http://www.freemaptools.com/how-far-is-it-between.htm http://www.freemaptools.com/how-far-is-it-between.htm I find 5600km for Amsterdam -> Islamabad, and 3900km from LA -> NY. So I was 40% off :P
      - kej 13y ago
        >Not sure what went wrong there :) Google Maps uses a modified Mercator projection, which distorts distances.
      - dalore 13y ago
        You are measure a 3d projection on a 2d plane. There has to be distortion somewhere. Most likely they use the mercator projection which has places further from the equator appear bigger than the ones near the equator.
      - Sharlin 13y ago
        The old Google Maps had/has a real distance measurement tool. Shame that the new doesn't, at least not yet.
aestra 13y ago
Seriously? You know she can die for doing this? Honor killings are real for women not obeying her family, especially in matters of sex and marriage. Sandeela Kanwal - killed by her parents for trying to leave her arranged marriage. Noor Almaleki - murdered by her parents for (among other things) shunning arranged marriage. The other things were trying to be too western, like wanting to have the privilege of driving a car. Those are the ones that just took place in the US lately. You have no idea what is is like to be in her situation!!
- strictfp 13y ago
  No, I have no idea what it's like. But I can imagine that it's quite similar to being held hostage. Running away as a hostage might also get you shot. But that doesn't mean you should stay with your oppressors.
- commentorY 13y ago
  In the article she said that she was worried that even if she escaped her mother or sister could be hurt. While the local law enforcement should protect her if her husband is abusive, there is nothing they can do about threats in a foreign land.

tinco 13y ago

You are forgetting that she is in college, and desires to continue to do so. Overtly saying no will most likely result in family or friends of family going after her in Spain. Once you enter the Shengen area of Europe, which is reachable by car from Pakistan you can basically get anywhere. There are countless easily traversed borders to this area in corrupt/poorer countries. After that there's close to no border checks. It is really easy for friends/family to get to Spain and make her life difficult there.

tinco 13y ago
Living in The Netherlands it's easy to forget that these countries are not actually separated from Europe in any way. The distance between Amsterdam and Pakistan is comparable (a bit longer) to the distance between L.A. and New York. A cool story that was recently in the Dutch news reduces that perceived distance, when an independent car rental business owner pursues and retrieves one of his cars all the way in Iraq: http://translate.google.nl/translate?sl=nl&tl=en&js=n&prev=_t&hl=nl&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fnos.nl%2Fartikel%2F595258-man-naar-irak-om-gestolen-autos.html http://translate.google.nl/translate?sl=nl&tl=en&js=n&prev=_... The thieves just rented a car, and drove there. Possibly to fight Jihad.
- khuey 13y ago
  Pakistan is much farther away than you think it is. http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=AMS-KHI,+JFK-LAX http://www.gcmap.com/mapui?P=AMS-KHI,+JFK-LAX
  - tinco 13y ago
    Hmm that's weird, I measured by going to google maps, spreading my fingers between Amsterdam and Pakistan. I then scrolled to the U.S. while holding my fingers in that position, and the distance difference was like ~20%, according to your flightplan it's almost twice as far though. Not sure what went wrong there :) edit: using http://www.freemaptools.com/how-far-is-it-between.htm http://www.freemaptools.com/how-far-is-it-between.htm I find 5600km for Amsterdam -> Islamabad, and 3900km from LA -> NY. So I was 40% off :P
    - kej 13y ago
      >Not sure what went wrong there :) Google Maps uses a modified Mercator projection, which distorts distances.
    - dalore 13y ago
      You are measure a 3d projection on a 2d plane. There has to be distortion somewhere. Most likely they use the mercator projection which has places further from the equator appear bigger than the ones near the equator.
    - Sharlin 13y ago
      The old Google Maps had/has a real distance measurement tool. Shame that the new doesn't, at least not yet.

aestra 13y ago

Seriously? You know she can die for doing this? Honor killings are real for women not obeying her family, especially in matters of sex and marriage. Sandeela Kanwal - killed by her parents for trying to leave her arranged marriage. Noor Almaleki - murdered by her parents for (among other things) shunning arranged marriage. The other things were trying to be too western, like wanting to have the privilege of driving a car. Those are the ones that just took place in the US lately. You have no idea what is is like to be in her situation!!

strictfp 13y ago
No, I have no idea what it's like. But I can imagine that it's quite similar to being held hostage. Running away as a hostage might also get you shot. But that doesn't mean you should stay with your oppressors.
commentorY 13y ago
In the article she said that she was worried that even if she escaped her mother or sister could be hurt. While the local law enforcement should protect her if her husband is abusive, there is nothing they can do about threats in a foreign land.