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what kind of meditation needs (or is helped) by this? i kind-of do mindful meditation (i'm no expert) and this would be just one more piece of sensory data to

what kind of meditation needs (or is helped) by this? i kind-of do mindful meditation (i'm no expert) and this would be just one more piece of sensory data to acknowledge and then largely ignore. if you're doing "concentrative meditation" (i'm using terms from wikipedia) then i would have thought this would be distracting. is this more like new age tv?

nabla9 13y ago
This is more like using suggestion to enable relaxation.
thucydides 13y ago
Good question. The site's 10 minute guided meditation right now does not sound like the forms of Zen meditation I'm familiar with, and it doesn't sound like mindfulness meditation. What is it? And is it evidence-based? I practice Zen-style breath-counting meditation (susokukan) now. No doubt many different kinds of meditation are beneficial, but I suspect they have different effect sizes. Probably some do nothing for you at all. The most unexpected consequence of breath-counting is how dispassionately I see my random intrusive thoughts during meditation, whether it's anger at someone, a happy memory, or a worry about some future task. It sounds crazy to non-meditators, but it's actually hard for me to not to laugh during meditation sessions at how ephemeral and "unreal" these thoughts are... and how quickly all emotions, sensations, thoughts move in and depart like blips on the screen of mind. After breath-counting for half an hour, I feel a much deeper, more substantial calm than if I'd done something like listening to relaxing noises in the same time. It's a calm of mind that bleeds into the rest of the day, because meditation gives practice at seeing the shape-shifting nature of thoughts and human identity. Does the kind of meditation practiced on this site have similar effects?
- dbtc 13y ago
  breath-counting meditation sounds really interesting, where did you learn about it? Any recommended resources?
  - KingMob 13y ago
    I can give you basic instructions based on what I've been given at Fire Lotus Zendo and Insight Meditation Society: Sit, get comfy, and calm down. Relax your eyes, your jaw, your shoulders, and anywhere you're carrying tension. WHen you're settled, focus on your breathing, pick one spot (belly, nostrils, nose, etc) and count each breath in your mind. Try to count softly; you want to pay attention to your breathing, not your counting. Start at 1 and go to 10. When/if you reach 10, start over again from 1. When you find yourself distracted by a thought (and you will), that's normal. Just acknowledge the thought, and start counting again from 1. Get curious about your breath. Is it hard or soft, fast or slow, dry or wet, smooth or ragged? Notice the pauses at the ends of the inhale and exhale: what's it like? What are the parts in-between like as it comes and goes? If you find the counting helpful, stick with it. If you find the counting too distracting, just try to pay attention to the breath without it. Lastly, don't worry too much if your mind is bouncing around like a monkey on a sugar rush; that's pretty normal. Most of the practice of meditation is continually coming back to the present moment, not attaining blissful thought-free emptiness (which is quite rare, even on retreat). Good luck
    - MichaelGG 13y ago
      Thanks. I find that when I focus on counting my breaths, I immediately start visualising the numbers. They get painted. Or flipped around in 3D. If I pay attention to breath, then it, too, takes on all sorts of stuff. A whistle-type breath might make me see a cliff with wind blowing by it, and then that'll trigger memories. I can't seem to get passed even 3.
      - seren 13y ago
        This is expected, if you are freeing some of your attention and focusing on your breathing, intrusive thoughts will likely arise. Don't get discouraged or angry about your lack of attention, just refocus "gently" on the breathing. And just keep going. With some practice, it becomes easier to stay on the breathing. The goal is not suppress or ignore those intrusive though anyway.
      - KingMob 13y ago
KingMob 13y ago
I agree with you in several ways, but to be charitable, just look at the site as a place to go to get some guided meditations for newbies. I think over time, people turn away from guided meditations as distracting (I know I do), but something like this could be helpful to the right person.

nabla9 13y ago

This is more like using suggestion to enable relaxation.

thucydides 13y ago

Good question. The site's 10 minute guided meditation right now does not sound like the forms of Zen meditation I'm familiar with, and it doesn't sound like mindfulness meditation. What is it? And is it evidence-based? I practice Zen-style breath-counting meditation (susokukan) now. No doubt many different kinds of meditation are beneficial, but I suspect they have different effect sizes. Probably some do nothing for you at all. The most unexpected consequence of breath-counting is how dispassionately I see my random intrusive thoughts during meditation, whether it's anger at someone, a happy memory, or a worry about some future task. It sounds crazy to non-meditators, but it's actually hard for me to not to laugh during meditation sessions at how ephemeral and "unreal" these thoughts are... and how quickly all emotions, sensations, thoughts move in and depart like blips on the screen of mind. After breath-counting for half an hour, I feel a much deeper, more substantial calm than if I'd done something like listening to relaxing noises in the same time. It's a calm of mind that bleeds into the rest of the day, because meditation gives practice at seeing the shape-shifting nature of thoughts and human identity. Does the kind of meditation practiced on this site have similar effects?

dbtc 13y ago
breath-counting meditation sounds really interesting, where did you learn about it? Any recommended resources?
- KingMob 13y ago
  I can give you basic instructions based on what I've been given at Fire Lotus Zendo and Insight Meditation Society: Sit, get comfy, and calm down. Relax your eyes, your jaw, your shoulders, and anywhere you're carrying tension. WHen you're settled, focus on your breathing, pick one spot (belly, nostrils, nose, etc) and count each breath in your mind. Try to count softly; you want to pay attention to your breathing, not your counting. Start at 1 and go to 10. When/if you reach 10, start over again from 1. When you find yourself distracted by a thought (and you will), that's normal. Just acknowledge the thought, and start counting again from 1. Get curious about your breath. Is it hard or soft, fast or slow, dry or wet, smooth or ragged? Notice the pauses at the ends of the inhale and exhale: what's it like? What are the parts in-between like as it comes and goes? If you find the counting helpful, stick with it. If you find the counting too distracting, just try to pay attention to the breath without it. Lastly, don't worry too much if your mind is bouncing around like a monkey on a sugar rush; that's pretty normal. Most of the practice of meditation is continually coming back to the present moment, not attaining blissful thought-free emptiness (which is quite rare, even on retreat). Good luck
  - MichaelGG 13y ago
    Thanks. I find that when I focus on counting my breaths, I immediately start visualising the numbers. They get painted. Or flipped around in 3D. If I pay attention to breath, then it, too, takes on all sorts of stuff. A whistle-type breath might make me see a cliff with wind blowing by it, and then that'll trigger memories. I can't seem to get passed even 3.
    - seren 13y ago
      This is expected, if you are freeing some of your attention and focusing on your breathing, intrusive thoughts will likely arise. Don't get discouraged or angry about your lack of attention, just refocus "gently" on the breathing. And just keep going. With some practice, it becomes easier to stay on the breathing. The goal is not suppress or ignore those intrusive though anyway.
    - KingMob 13y ago

KingMob 13y ago

I agree with you in several ways, but to be charitable, just look at the site as a place to go to get some guided meditations for newbies. I think over time, people turn away from guided meditations as distracting (I know I do), but something like this could be helpful to the right person.