4 ms·

The private pilot is a dying breed. Skyrocketing costs make it all but impossible for most people to get into. Even getting your private pilot's license often c

by jcoby 13y ago

The private pilot is a dying breed. Skyrocketing costs make it all but impossible for most people to get into. Even getting your private pilot's license often costs $8k-$10k. And then you are looking at $150/hr to fly a 20-30 year old C172. These skyrocketing costs make it so the fleet ages and becomes less reliable. So people get out. Or they die because they can't fly enough to get experience or the aircraft has a problem because it isn't flown enough. And costs rise further because there is no market. It's a downward spiral. And it seems that the FAA is completely happy with the situation. I've been out on beautiful days (low 80s, calm, 10 mi vis) and the CTAF is all but dead. Even 5 years ago there would have been 2-3 in the pattern and I would have heard a steady stream of traffic around the other 5 airports in the same frequency.

smackfu 13y ago
Most people I know who've done it are older and need a hobby and have spare money when their kids are gone and mortgage is paid off.
- jcoby 13y ago
  True. Or they bought the plane 20+ years ago and still own it. When I go to EAA meetings I'm the youngest by 15-20 years and I'm in my 30s. I don't think I've ever seen a privately owned certified plane that was newer than 25 years old. It's all around a bad situation for general aviation.
  - nathanstitt 13y ago
    Same here. I'm in my late 30s and am by far the youngest at any pilot gathering I attend. I really don't know where the airlines are going to get the next generation of pilots from. Of course with the horrible pay and hours, I can't blame anyone from not choosing that career path.
    - jcoby 13y ago
      I've heard that starting pay for ATP or cargo is somewhere in the low $20s and schooling is in the mid $100s. Is there any truth to that?
      - nathanstitt 13y ago
        Yep, that's about right. If you do it right, schooling can be quite a bit cheaper, but starting is sometimes even less than 20k. Plus figure in "working" 60+ hours a week and only getting paid for 30-40 of them. It's not uncommon for airlines to fly pilots from city to city to stage them for flights. But they only pay them for the time they are actually touching the controls. So they get up at 3am to catch series of flights, then don't start getting paid until noon.
    - smackfu 13y ago
      >I really don't know where the airlines are going to get the next generation of pilots from. The military. As usual.
      - nathanstitt 13y ago
        Eh, I'm not so sure that'll happen. Military pilots aren't getting as many hours as they used to, plus it's actually a pay drop for them to leave and work for an airliner the way it is right now. Right now the airlines have managed to talk high school grads into taking out huge student loans and drop 100K+ on a for-profit school, then take a job making ~ 20. There's no way that's sustainable though.
        nanidin 13y ago
        When my neighbor retired from the airforce, he moved on to flying planes for FedEx. He is paid VERY well for that.
        nathanstitt 13y ago
        I've always heard that FedEx and Southwest are the absolute best employers for pilots, and the regional carriers (who I was primarily talking about earlier) are the absolute worst. No real idea on how accurate that is, just stuff I've overheard in pilot lounges at airports :)
  - jamra 13y ago
    I have a close friend who owns two new Cirus planes. There are tons of people who own jets as well. It all depends on your economic bracket. I think, though, that the private plane industry is going towards smaller, more expensive aircraft. It is more of a microcosm of the economy than anything else. People still fly Cesnas because they are very stable and were not built with planned obsolescence in mind.
clueless123 13y ago
One alternative is to go the LSA route (Light Sport Aircraft) they are substantially cheaper to buy and operate, plus the instruction requirements and Medical test are easier too.
greyshi 13y ago
"The private pilot is a dying breed." Yes, literally.

by jcoby 13y ago

smackfu 13y ago

Most people I know who've done it are older and need a hobby and have spare money when their kids are gone and mortgage is paid off.

jcoby 13y ago
True. Or they bought the plane 20+ years ago and still own it. When I go to EAA meetings I'm the youngest by 15-20 years and I'm in my 30s. I don't think I've ever seen a privately owned certified plane that was newer than 25 years old. It's all around a bad situation for general aviation.
- nathanstitt 13y ago
  Same here. I'm in my late 30s and am by far the youngest at any pilot gathering I attend. I really don't know where the airlines are going to get the next generation of pilots from. Of course with the horrible pay and hours, I can't blame anyone from not choosing that career path.
  - jcoby 13y ago
    I've heard that starting pay for ATP or cargo is somewhere in the low $20s and schooling is in the mid $100s. Is there any truth to that?
    - nathanstitt 13y ago
      Yep, that's about right. If you do it right, schooling can be quite a bit cheaper, but starting is sometimes even less than 20k. Plus figure in "working" 60+ hours a week and only getting paid for 30-40 of them. It's not uncommon for airlines to fly pilots from city to city to stage them for flights. But they only pay them for the time they are actually touching the controls. So they get up at 3am to catch series of flights, then don't start getting paid until noon.
  - smackfu 13y ago
    >I really don't know where the airlines are going to get the next generation of pilots from. The military. As usual.
    - nathanstitt 13y ago
      Eh, I'm not so sure that'll happen. Military pilots aren't getting as many hours as they used to, plus it's actually a pay drop for them to leave and work for an airliner the way it is right now. Right now the airlines have managed to talk high school grads into taking out huge student loans and drop 100K+ on a for-profit school, then take a job making ~ 20. There's no way that's sustainable though.
      - nanidin 13y ago
        When my neighbor retired from the airforce, he moved on to flying planes for FedEx. He is paid VERY well for that.
        nathanstitt 13y ago
        I've always heard that FedEx and Southwest are the absolute best employers for pilots, and the regional carriers (who I was primarily talking about earlier) are the absolute worst. No real idea on how accurate that is, just stuff I've overheard in pilot lounges at airports :)
- jamra 13y ago
  I have a close friend who owns two new Cirus planes. There are tons of people who own jets as well. It all depends on your economic bracket. I think, though, that the private plane industry is going towards smaller, more expensive aircraft. It is more of a microcosm of the economy than anything else. People still fly Cesnas because they are very stable and were not built with planned obsolescence in mind.

clueless123 13y ago

One alternative is to go the LSA route (Light Sport Aircraft) they are substantially cheaper to buy and operate, plus the instruction requirements and Medical test are easier too.

greyshi 13y ago

"The private pilot is a dying breed." Yes, literally.