4 ms·

>Is it really vulgar to desire money and take it as indicator of success Yes? It is not only vulgar, it is utterly clueless.

x0054 13y ago
Money is certainly not an indicator of true success, other than, of course, success of acquiring money. However, why is money vulgar. Sure, there are many vulgar things one can purchase with money. But money in and of it self isn't vulgar. Many people here want to understand how WhatsApp managed to convince someone to pay so much money for it, perhaps so they can replicate this success and also become rich. What's so wrong with that?
- toomuchtodo 13y ago
  > perhaps so they can replicate this success and also become rich. What's so wrong with that? My theory: Perhaps because an ever growing population of tech professionals are disgusted with the race for more wealth? I will be the first to admit, I'm an Elon Musk fanboy, although I think its justified. Instagram. Whatsapp. Messaging apps! Billions of dollars! For messaging! With that same amount of cash, Musk has delivered goods to an orbiting space station and has succeeded in changing the direction of transportation, something an entire auto industry wouldn't (not couldn't, wouldn't) do. I could be wrong. Perhaps money is still the end goal for everyone. If its just to have money for money's sake, I feel sad for you. If its to pursue your passion, I think we can all empathize with that.
  - gaius 13y ago
    Musk had to make his fortune first...
    - toomuchtodo 13y ago
      I get making your fortune. My point was: Use the opportunity you get from it wisely.
  - x0054 13y ago
    Money for money sake is silly. You can't take it to your grave, and you can't enjoy it unless you spend it. But there are a lot of cool toys money can buy, like space rockets or cool cars and motorcycles. In my case money would buy me time for tinkering with unprofitable projects and building things with my hands, which I enjoy doing
stingraycharles 13y ago
That totally depends on what your goals in life are and is highly subjective.
- Helianthus 13y ago
  Forgive me if I'm contemptuous of those whose subjective goal is the acquisition of money.
  - davidw 13y ago
    I want the freedom to do what I want, and in my case that involves a certain quantity of money. Not tons of it, but more than I have now.
    - Helianthus 13y ago
      There's paying the bills, and there's lust for percentages of 16 billion dollars.
      - davidw 13y ago
        And who are you to say what is the "correct" amount of money for people to desire? This really wasn't the appropriate thread to hijack for this discussion anyway; I came here to talk about Erlang.
        Helianthus 13y ago
        I'm not specifying an amount or a correctness, and I do not disagree that there is a line between means and end. I'm saying that HN's attention span is dominated by dollar signs.
        parasubvert 13y ago
        What do you expect? It's a startup-oriented hacker bulletin board run by a guy that suggests that hiring is obsolete and most nerds should be able to start a new venture and make a killing. Even if it's overly optimistic, it's a pretty reasonable aspiration compared to the wage slavery most have to endure, so I fail to see why this is wrong. There are plenty more of stories of failure studied at HN than successes like WhatsApp. That's actually more correlated with reality than the mainstream business media that focuses mostly on success.
patrickaljord 13y ago
There's nothing vulgar or clueless with loving money and wanting more of it. Most startups got started thanks to people who have insane amounts of money and enjoy making more, this includes investors in startups that changed the world such as Google, Apple and Facebook. The world needs people who love money so they can fund people who love making stuff that put this money to good use. Simple as that. So yeah, get off your high horse and please stop lecturing people with cheap and meaningless moral judgments.
- Helianthus 13y ago
  >please stop lecturing people with cheap and meaningless moral judgments. Ha. I'm not lecturing; I simply have no respect or consideration for your position. You are not being lectured: you are encountering an attitude with which you disagree, and one that has no regard for your disagreement.
  - patrickaljord 13y ago
    I didn't say I personally enjoy making money more than coding/building cool stuff. I just said it was ok if some people do. And yes, when you call something "vulgar and utterly clueless", you're definitely making moral judgments. > consideration for your position You have enough consideration to feel like posting a comment about how much you feel about it.
    - Helianthus 13y ago
      >And yes, when you call something "vulgar and utterly clueless", you're definitely making moral judgments. I know! My point is merely that I wasn't lecturing. >You have enough consideration to feel like posting a comment about how much you feel about it. I suppose I enjoy throwing the moral imperative into sharp relief; making it clear just how much I disdain your vulgar acceptance of the love of wanting money. That moral imperative alone is enough to carry weight in this thread. It has wandered in as mere sentiment without ever presenting an argument. ...Now, of course, I have strayed into lecturing you about the mechanics of this whole thing--but note I still have not lectured you with the moral judgment itself. I don't care about convincing you that money is vulgar. Sanctimony is enough for me. You are quite right, though; I have spent enough time here.
bentcorner 13y ago
> Yes? It is not only vulgar, it is utterly clueless. I don't have the knowledge or experience to say otherwise, so if someone were to ask me if WhatsApp was a success, $16B seems like a good reason to say yes. Are you implying that WhatsApp's sale was a failure case for their owners, and success for them would have looked differently? (reject the sale and continue growth of the platform?)

x0054 13y ago

Money is certainly not an indicator of true success, other than, of course, success of acquiring money. However, why is money vulgar. Sure, there are many vulgar things one can purchase with money. But money in and of it self isn't vulgar. Many people here want to understand how WhatsApp managed to convince someone to pay so much money for it, perhaps so they can replicate this success and also become rich. What's so wrong with that?

toomuchtodo 13y ago
> perhaps so they can replicate this success and also become rich. What's so wrong with that? My theory: Perhaps because an ever growing population of tech professionals are disgusted with the race for more wealth? I will be the first to admit, I'm an Elon Musk fanboy, although I think its justified. Instagram. Whatsapp. Messaging apps! Billions of dollars! For messaging! With that same amount of cash, Musk has delivered goods to an orbiting space station and has succeeded in changing the direction of transportation, something an entire auto industry wouldn't (not couldn't, wouldn't) do. I could be wrong. Perhaps money is still the end goal for everyone. If its just to have money for money's sake, I feel sad for you. If its to pursue your passion, I think we can all empathize with that.
- gaius 13y ago
  Musk had to make his fortune first...
  - toomuchtodo 13y ago
    I get making your fortune. My point was: Use the opportunity you get from it wisely.
- x0054 13y ago
  Money for money sake is silly. You can't take it to your grave, and you can't enjoy it unless you spend it. But there are a lot of cool toys money can buy, like space rockets or cool cars and motorcycles. In my case money would buy me time for tinkering with unprofitable projects and building things with my hands, which I enjoy doing

stingraycharles 13y ago

That totally depends on what your goals in life are and is highly subjective.

Helianthus 13y ago
Forgive me if I'm contemptuous of those whose subjective goal is the acquisition of money.
- davidw 13y ago
  I want the freedom to do what I want, and in my case that involves a certain quantity of money. Not tons of it, but more than I have now.
  - Helianthus 13y ago
    There's paying the bills, and there's lust for percentages of 16 billion dollars.
    - davidw 13y ago
      And who are you to say what is the "correct" amount of money for people to desire? This really wasn't the appropriate thread to hijack for this discussion anyway; I came here to talk about Erlang.
      - Helianthus 13y ago
        I'm not specifying an amount or a correctness, and I do not disagree that there is a line between means and end. I'm saying that HN's attention span is dominated by dollar signs.
        parasubvert 13y ago
        What do you expect? It's a startup-oriented hacker bulletin board run by a guy that suggests that hiring is obsolete and most nerds should be able to start a new venture and make a killing. Even if it's overly optimistic, it's a pretty reasonable aspiration compared to the wage slavery most have to endure, so I fail to see why this is wrong. There are plenty more of stories of failure studied at HN than successes like WhatsApp. That's actually more correlated with reality than the mainstream business media that focuses mostly on success.

patrickaljord 13y ago

There's nothing vulgar or clueless with loving money and wanting more of it. Most startups got started thanks to people who have insane amounts of money and enjoy making more, this includes investors in startups that changed the world such as Google, Apple and Facebook. The world needs people who love money so they can fund people who love making stuff that put this money to good use. Simple as that. So yeah, get off your high horse and please stop lecturing people with cheap and meaningless moral judgments.

Helianthus 13y ago
>please stop lecturing people with cheap and meaningless moral judgments. Ha. I'm not lecturing; I simply have no respect or consideration for your position. You are not being lectured: you are encountering an attitude with which you disagree, and one that has no regard for your disagreement.
- patrickaljord 13y ago
  I didn't say I personally enjoy making money more than coding/building cool stuff. I just said it was ok if some people do. And yes, when you call something "vulgar and utterly clueless", you're definitely making moral judgments. > consideration for your position You have enough consideration to feel like posting a comment about how much you feel about it.
  - Helianthus 13y ago
    >And yes, when you call something "vulgar and utterly clueless", you're definitely making moral judgments. I know! My point is merely that I wasn't lecturing. >You have enough consideration to feel like posting a comment about how much you feel about it. I suppose I enjoy throwing the moral imperative into sharp relief; making it clear just how much I disdain your vulgar acceptance of the love of wanting money. That moral imperative alone is enough to carry weight in this thread. It has wandered in as mere sentiment without ever presenting an argument. ...Now, of course, I have strayed into lecturing you about the mechanics of this whole thing--but note I still have not lectured you with the moral judgment itself. I don't care about convincing you that money is vulgar. Sanctimony is enough for me. You are quite right, though; I have spent enough time here.

bentcorner 13y ago

> Yes? It is not only vulgar, it is utterly clueless. I don't have the knowledge or experience to say otherwise, so if someone were to ask me if WhatsApp was a success, $16B seems like a good reason to say yes. Are you implying that WhatsApp's sale was a failure case for their owners, and success for them would have looked differently? (reject the sale and continue growth of the platform?)