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At some level, rape is absolutely a product of evolution, unless you don't believe in evolution. The desire for a male to have sex with a female is so strong th

by ellyagg 17y ago

At some level, rape is absolutely a product of evolution, unless you don't believe in evolution. The desire for a male to have sex with a female is so strong that it approaches a need. Acknowledging this doesn't condone rape, but it does allow us to not be morons.

dantheman 17y ago
Isn't all human behavior is a product of evolution by definition? Humans like to explore because it can improve their mating chances due to prestige, wealth, less competitation (those unsuccessful thin the pack) hence people went to the moon. I'm not trying to be a troll, but how can we have behavior that wasn't caused by evolution?
- jibiki 17y ago
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spandrel_(biology) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spandrel_(biology) Not contradicting you, just saying there are shades of nuance to the verb "to cause".
- ellyagg 17y ago
  Sure, any behavior is going to be a product of evolution and environment. Of course, sex is actually the mechanism of evolution, so it's doubtful that pretending behaviors associated with it are not strongly related to it will yield sensible results.
- berntb 17y ago
  >>I'm not trying to be a troll, but how can we have behavior that wasn't caused by evolution? We are genetically programmed (from evolution) to get most of our behavior from culture. That is what evolutionary biologists (and evolutionary psychologists) say, afaik. So lots of behavior is based on evolution, by way of cultural evolution. (Then there is random noise etc.) Edit: I might add that I believe the book about rape wasn't exactly seen as the best of research in the evol psychology area... But I've also seen lots of ideologically motivated (marxists and religious) attacks on evol psych.
- sethg 17y ago
  If I eat soup with a spoon rather than a fork, does that prove that I have an eating-soup-with-a-spoon gene that was passed down to me by my Pleistocene ancestors, while carriers of the competing eating-soup-with-a-fork gene died of thirst? Obviously there are some aspects of human behavior that were probably selected for in a Darwinian fashion; it's probably no accident that most humans prefer not to live a celibate life, for example. But that doesn't mean you can trace the link from every behavior back to some genetic root.
akamaka 17y ago
Actually, there will always be behaviours that are not the product of evolution (as in natural selection of desirable qualities). There's always a chance of randomness in gene reproduction, and so we live in a world where a few people are afflicted with genetic diseases (like down syndrome). Perhaps you are using a broader definition of "evolution"?
jberryman 17y ago
Sex-drive is a product of evolution, certainly. Rape is byproduct of that evolutionary trait (among others; rape in modern humans is a complicated thing). But there are many compelling reasons why rape is not evolutionarily beneficial to humans, among them, that strong family bonds seem to be important to our mutual survival, and that rape is an end-run on an extremely important mechanism of natural selection: a woman's desire to mate with a male with "good" genes.
- dan_the_welder 17y ago
  Just a thought, but when did rape appear and when did we become aware that sex and birth were related? I mean a fellow seeds and flees and 9 months later, who is the wiser?

by ellyagg 17y ago

dantheman 17y ago

Isn't all human behavior is a product of evolution by definition? Humans like to explore because it can improve their mating chances due to prestige, wealth, less competitation (those unsuccessful thin the pack) hence people went to the moon. I'm not trying to be a troll, but how can we have behavior that wasn't caused by evolution?

jibiki 17y ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spandrel_(biology) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spandrel_(biology) Not contradicting you, just saying there are shades of nuance to the verb "to cause".
ellyagg 17y ago
Sure, any behavior is going to be a product of evolution and environment. Of course, sex is actually the mechanism of evolution, so it's doubtful that pretending behaviors associated with it are not strongly related to it will yield sensible results.
berntb 17y ago
>>I'm not trying to be a troll, but how can we have behavior that wasn't caused by evolution? We are genetically programmed (from evolution) to get most of our behavior from culture. That is what evolutionary biologists (and evolutionary psychologists) say, afaik. So lots of behavior is based on evolution, by way of cultural evolution. (Then there is random noise etc.) Edit: I might add that I believe the book about rape wasn't exactly seen as the best of research in the evol psychology area... But I've also seen lots of ideologically motivated (marxists and religious) attacks on evol psych.
sethg 17y ago
If I eat soup with a spoon rather than a fork, does that prove that I have an eating-soup-with-a-spoon gene that was passed down to me by my Pleistocene ancestors, while carriers of the competing eating-soup-with-a-fork gene died of thirst? Obviously there are some aspects of human behavior that were probably selected for in a Darwinian fashion; it's probably no accident that most humans prefer not to live a celibate life, for example. But that doesn't mean you can trace the link from every behavior back to some genetic root.

akamaka 17y ago

Actually, there will always be behaviours that are not the product of evolution (as in natural selection of desirable qualities). There's always a chance of randomness in gene reproduction, and so we live in a world where a few people are afflicted with genetic diseases (like down syndrome). Perhaps you are using a broader definition of "evolution"?

jberryman 17y ago

Sex-drive is a product of evolution, certainly. Rape is byproduct of that evolutionary trait (among others; rape in modern humans is a complicated thing). But there are many compelling reasons why rape is not evolutionarily beneficial to humans, among them, that strong family bonds seem to be important to our mutual survival, and that rape is an end-run on an extremely important mechanism of natural selection: a woman's desire to mate with a male with "good" genes.

dan_the_welder 17y ago
Just a thought, but when did rape appear and when did we become aware that sex and birth were related? I mean a fellow seeds and flees and 9 months later, who is the wiser?