3 ms·

So where are immigrants concentrating themselves if not the US? I am not looking for the response, 'They are going home,' but surely the intelligentsia is conc

by Leon 17y ago

So where are immigrants concentrating themselves if not the US? I am not looking for the response, 'They are going home,' but surely the intelligentsia is concentrating in some area so where is it? Is it just that the distribution is more even with respect to country (in which case the US would still be the lead) or is there a new, hot area (maybe parts of europe)?

potatolicious 17y ago
I think that immigration to Canada is still on the rise. I can't source it, but I think I heard that immigration to Canada from American citizens has tripled in the last few years... As an educated professional with a college degree and whatnot, and one who speaks fluent English (or French), entry into Canada is almost a no-brainer under the skilled workforce immigration policy. This is really an attitude thing. In the beginning the US was the place to be, so as non-Americans we all put up with the rampant bullshit you had to go through to get in the door. Now, there are choices, and the xenophobic attitude and the circus-like hoops you have to jump through to get in are no longer as attractive. Not to mention that the US is now dealing with some major social changes (read: problems) that other countries have managed to avoid... health care for one...
- ajju 17y ago
  Actually Canada actively recruits US immigrants. Send an email about H-1B visas using Gmail and soon you'll see an ad on the top saying something like "Stuck in an H1B visa? Canada will give you an expedited residency if you are a qualified immigrant". And it's goes to a Canadian govt. website with a form asking for your phone number. THEY contact YOU! If I could bear the cold I'd skoot over to Toronto in the blink of an eye.
  - potatolicious 17y ago
    To be fair, get ready for a rude income shock. I am one of the (few?) Canadians who recently came to the US to work. Why? Honestly, because I got an offer that was double what any Canadian company was willing to offer me. Software in Canada is second class - salaries are nowhere near the US levels, and much of the work is "scrap" from Americans. Everywhere I look in Canada I see satellite offices to large American software companies. Invariably these offices do the boring, mundane code that nobody wants to pay $150K to a Californian to do. That's what I mean when I say "scrap" - monkey work, not real dev. It's hard to find a Canadian shop that writes real, meaningful code.
    - ajju 17y ago
      Good point. I want to work for my own startup though so access to a large number of customers is more important to me. I don't yet know how this compares (the ease of finding new customers in Canada as well as traveling to the US as a Canadian resident to meet customers) but I am looking into it.
      - potatolicious 17y ago
        Customer-wise stay in the US I say :) Canada doesn't really have a consumer culture to the tune of the USA, and because of lower income and higher taxes, you need to sell harder to get our money. For tech companies focusing on mobile apps this is especially troublesome. Telecommunications in Canada is expensive as hell, and come with a ludicrous number of strings attached. Want to do a high-bandwidth site like Hulu? Forget it, your customers get hit with overage fees from their ISP like the plague. Want to do a mobile app? Sky high costs for data plans means your customer base is severely limited, and even the ones that do have it are apprehensive about going over their paltry (500MB to 2GB!) monthly limits. I wouldn't consider doing a Canadian startup that sells to Canadians. I would, however, consider a Canadian startup that sells to Americans :)
        ajju 17y ago
        Thanks. That's useful input! :)

by Leon 17y ago

potatolicious 17y ago

I think that immigration to Canada is still on the rise. I can't source it, but I think I heard that immigration to Canada from American citizens has tripled in the last few years... As an educated professional with a college degree and whatnot, and one who speaks fluent English (or French), entry into Canada is almost a no-brainer under the skilled workforce immigration policy. This is really an attitude thing. In the beginning the US was the place to be, so as non-Americans we all put up with the rampant bullshit you had to go through to get in the door. Now, there are choices, and the xenophobic attitude and the circus-like hoops you have to jump through to get in are no longer as attractive. Not to mention that the US is now dealing with some major social changes (read: problems) that other countries have managed to avoid... health care for one...

ajju 17y ago
Actually Canada actively recruits US immigrants. Send an email about H-1B visas using Gmail and soon you'll see an ad on the top saying something like "Stuck in an H1B visa? Canada will give you an expedited residency if you are a qualified immigrant". And it's goes to a Canadian govt. website with a form asking for your phone number. THEY contact YOU! If I could bear the cold I'd skoot over to Toronto in the blink of an eye.
- potatolicious 17y ago
  To be fair, get ready for a rude income shock. I am one of the (few?) Canadians who recently came to the US to work. Why? Honestly, because I got an offer that was double what any Canadian company was willing to offer me. Software in Canada is second class - salaries are nowhere near the US levels, and much of the work is "scrap" from Americans. Everywhere I look in Canada I see satellite offices to large American software companies. Invariably these offices do the boring, mundane code that nobody wants to pay $150K to a Californian to do. That's what I mean when I say "scrap" - monkey work, not real dev. It's hard to find a Canadian shop that writes real, meaningful code.
  - ajju 17y ago
    Good point. I want to work for my own startup though so access to a large number of customers is more important to me. I don't yet know how this compares (the ease of finding new customers in Canada as well as traveling to the US as a Canadian resident to meet customers) but I am looking into it.
    - potatolicious 17y ago
      Customer-wise stay in the US I say :) Canada doesn't really have a consumer culture to the tune of the USA, and because of lower income and higher taxes, you need to sell harder to get our money. For tech companies focusing on mobile apps this is especially troublesome. Telecommunications in Canada is expensive as hell, and come with a ludicrous number of strings attached. Want to do a high-bandwidth site like Hulu? Forget it, your customers get hit with overage fees from their ISP like the plague. Want to do a mobile app? Sky high costs for data plans means your customer base is severely limited, and even the ones that do have it are apprehensive about going over their paltry (500MB to 2GB!) monthly limits. I wouldn't consider doing a Canadian startup that sells to Canadians. I would, however, consider a Canadian startup that sells to Americans :)
      - ajju 17y ago
        Thanks. That's useful input! :)