4 ms·

The "news" takeaway from this is for those of us who are fathers to young children, we can still involve our children in our work, be actively involved in their

The "news" takeaway from this is for those of us who are fathers to young children, we can still involve our children in our work, be actively involved in their lives, and still be incredibly successful. I know I'm guilty of sometimes thinking my kids "get in the way" of my career. This is an excellent post for setting us straight, thank you for this. I need to be reminded of this once in a while!

lutusp 13y ago
My ideal, beautiful children have never interfered with my work in the slightest, and my ravishing wife has never complained that (as was alleged about Richard Feynman) I never annoyed her by being lost in thoughts about Calculus. My children turned out perfectly, and my wife always looks like Ellen Page on her best day (http://www.nerdacy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/ellen_page-wide.jpg http://www.nerdacy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/ellen_page...). The reason? I never married. I never had children. Life is complicated enough without looking for trouble.
- sentenza 13y ago
  Do you also play computer games on easy mode? But joking aside, I personally must say that the chaos that having children brought to my life is a positive aspect of the whole experience. It keeps me from becoming complacent and has forced me to develop some intrisical organizational habits and discipline.
  - lutusp 13y ago
    > Do you also play computer games on easy mode? :) Computer games are no problem -- they never say, "What have you done for me lately?" Win or lose, you can walk away. I emphasize I'm not pretending that my choices are suitable for anyone else. To each his/her own.
    - nfoz 13y ago
      > :) Computer games are no problem -- they never say, "What have you done for me lately?" Win or lose, you can walk away. You've never played an MMO...
      - lutusp 13y ago
        > You've never played an MMO... It's true, I confess it. :) My favorite South Park episode is the one where the boys spend their time immersed in World of Warcraft -- http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episodes/s10e08-make-love-not-warcraft http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episodes/s10e08-make-lo...
- smoyer 13y ago
  My ideal, beautiful children have never interfered with my work in the slightest as my work is an interruption of my interaction with them (and my wife). My ravishing wife has never wrongfully complained that I annoyed her for be lost in thoughts. When my family is around, why should I be "zoned out". Married (and childrened) people often try to convince those who do without that they too should indulge - "you don't know what you're missing". If you came to the decision that a family isn't important to you, then you'd also be horrible at it (resentment can be a big issue). When an "unfamilied" person declares how pristine their life is, why can't they stop there? Your "without looking for trouble" phrase turns your personal choice into a religious battle ... there was no need. As for how your comment ties into the post shared here? It doesn't. My kids have defaced my papers (and sometimes the walls of our house) ... they're now cherished keepsakes!
  - coldpie 13y ago
    There's a lot of societal pressure to find a partner and have children. It's not hard to understand where a feeling of resentment comes from for those who aren't interested in that lifestyle after decades of being pushed towards it.
    - solipsism 13y ago
      I can understand that some have pressure from family. But societal pressure? I've never seen or experienced that, certainly not for males. Could you describe some concrete examples?
      - smoyer 13y ago
        There was a couple at our church who asked when we were going to start a family - the Sunday after we returned from our honeymoon. I think perhaps there can be a localized societal pressure, but I don't think you can look at the US and say there's an overall pressure.
      - lutusp 13y ago
        > But societal pressure? I've never seen or experienced that, certainly not for males. Not my experience. For years, when I was younger, I was pressured in many overt and subtle ways to be married and have children. A number of friendships eventually ended because my unwillingness to be married was a deal-breaker. On hearing me express my lack of interest in marriage, one guy asked, "When are you going to start living up to your responsibilities?" That was the day I found out what "proletarian" means. My favorite story in that connection was the day a woman I was dating confessed that, contrary to outward appearances, she had chosen me for my intelligence and was doing all she could be become pregnant by me. I instantly ended the relationship and began to seek a vasectomy. But then the fun began -- most doctors refused to perform the vasectomy because I wasn't already married and I hadn't already had "my children". Others insisted that I had to get my wife's signature -- no wife, no procedure. One doctor initially agreed, then, when he discovered I wasn't a member of a minority group, refused. Finally I met the ultimate western doctor who, on hearing my request, launched into a seemingly rehearsed speech that began, "Your sperm belongs to the state, son." I regretted not recording the conversation for posterity. Then I heard about Planned Parenthood. They gave me a short speech about how the procedure was irreversible, then performed it. Since then, since the vasectomy, on a couple of occasions I've had women say, "I'm late! And I think it's yours! Okay, I might have forgotten just this once to be disciplined about birth control, but haven't you ever been swept up in passion?" That's why I'm a Planned Parenthood supporter. :)
- aurelius 13y ago
  As a father of three, with #4 on the way, I can get on board with that last sentence. But there's nothing like being married, having kids, and living the constant struggle to be a good husband and a good dad. Having a family will make it painfully obvious what your faults are, and how they affect other people. You will have to face up to those faults, and deal with them. If you don't, it's a disaster. Life certainly is complicated, but the good stuff never comes easy (or cheap). You can stay single, be happy, and hide from yourself. Marriage and kids drags you out of bed and forces you see the light of day.
  - lutusp 13y ago
    > You can stay single, be happy, and hide from yourself. Again, I'm not pretending that my choices are for everyone, but I think the case can be persuasively made that an equal number of people hide from themselves by getting married as by staying single. My point is that there are a great number of "right choices", not just one.
    - aurelius 13y ago
      I don't disagree. My point was that choosing to be married and have children is a unique undertaking that is extremely challenging, but a lot of goodness can be gained by submitting to the hard work of being a good spouse and a good parent. Sure, you can shoot it down with counter-examples of bad parenting, bad spouses, bad children, etc.. Still, there's nothing like it, and it's worth speaking about the positive aspects of heterosexual marriage in a forum dominated by, quite frankly, people like you who have an irrational, negative, and hostile attitude towards non-gay marriage and families, to the extreme point where mutilation of your reproductive system is an acceptable choice. Yes, there are a great number of "right choices", but some are objectively better than others. A lot better.
      - lutusp 13y ago
        > Still, there's nothing like it ... Very true, and in the long term, there's nothing but it -- only those who make this choice are represented in the future population. The rest of us live on, not as organisms, but as memes. > Yes, there are a great number of "right choices", but some are objectively better than others. A lot better. Surely you understand that that sentence contradicts itself, yes? If one "right choice" is a lot better than another, this means there's only one right choice -- the choices aren't equivalent, or even comparable. > Still, there's nothing like it, and it's worth speaking about the positive aspects of heterosexual marriage in a forum dominated by, quite frankly, people like you who have an irrational, negative, and hostile attitude towards non-gay marriage and families, to the extreme point where mutilation of your reproductive system is an acceptable choice. Ah -- now I get it: choosing not to have children is mutilation. I read your post out of order, but in sum it makes its point very clearly. To those reading this thread who expressed doubt that there are people who refuse to accept any choice but marriage and children -- hey! I found one, and there are many more.
diminish 13y ago
indeed in earlier societies children were joining the parents in the "serious" part of life earlier than it's the case nowadays. My little 1.5 years old is doing his best to prove he can use a smartphone, tablet, and notebook the way his father uses, alas he can't join me to do the real work i'm doing on emacs. if we were hunter/gatherers i could show him the grown-up life earlier :)

lutusp 13y ago

My ideal, beautiful children have never interfered with my work in the slightest, and my ravishing wife has never complained that (as was alleged about Richard Feynman) I never annoyed her by being lost in thoughts about Calculus. My children turned out perfectly, and my wife always looks like Ellen Page on her best day (http://www.nerdacy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/ellen_page-wide.jpg http://www.nerdacy.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/ellen_page...). The reason? I never married. I never had children. Life is complicated enough without looking for trouble.

sentenza 13y ago
Do you also play computer games on easy mode? But joking aside, I personally must say that the chaos that having children brought to my life is a positive aspect of the whole experience. It keeps me from becoming complacent and has forced me to develop some intrisical organizational habits and discipline.
- lutusp 13y ago
  > Do you also play computer games on easy mode? :) Computer games are no problem -- they never say, "What have you done for me lately?" Win or lose, you can walk away. I emphasize I'm not pretending that my choices are suitable for anyone else. To each his/her own.
  - nfoz 13y ago
    > :) Computer games are no problem -- they never say, "What have you done for me lately?" Win or lose, you can walk away. You've never played an MMO...
    - lutusp 13y ago
      > You've never played an MMO... It's true, I confess it. :) My favorite South Park episode is the one where the boys spend their time immersed in World of Warcraft -- http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episodes/s10e08-make-love-not-warcraft http://www.southparkstudios.com/full-episodes/s10e08-make-lo...
smoyer 13y ago
My ideal, beautiful children have never interfered with my work in the slightest as my work is an interruption of my interaction with them (and my wife). My ravishing wife has never wrongfully complained that I annoyed her for be lost in thoughts. When my family is around, why should I be "zoned out". Married (and childrened) people often try to convince those who do without that they too should indulge - "you don't know what you're missing". If you came to the decision that a family isn't important to you, then you'd also be horrible at it (resentment can be a big issue). When an "unfamilied" person declares how pristine their life is, why can't they stop there? Your "without looking for trouble" phrase turns your personal choice into a religious battle ... there was no need. As for how your comment ties into the post shared here? It doesn't. My kids have defaced my papers (and sometimes the walls of our house) ... they're now cherished keepsakes!
- coldpie 13y ago
  There's a lot of societal pressure to find a partner and have children. It's not hard to understand where a feeling of resentment comes from for those who aren't interested in that lifestyle after decades of being pushed towards it.
  - solipsism 13y ago
    I can understand that some have pressure from family. But societal pressure? I've never seen or experienced that, certainly not for males. Could you describe some concrete examples?
    - smoyer 13y ago
      There was a couple at our church who asked when we were going to start a family - the Sunday after we returned from our honeymoon. I think perhaps there can be a localized societal pressure, but I don't think you can look at the US and say there's an overall pressure.
    - lutusp 13y ago
      > But societal pressure? I've never seen or experienced that, certainly not for males. Not my experience. For years, when I was younger, I was pressured in many overt and subtle ways to be married and have children. A number of friendships eventually ended because my unwillingness to be married was a deal-breaker. On hearing me express my lack of interest in marriage, one guy asked, "When are you going to start living up to your responsibilities?" That was the day I found out what "proletarian" means. My favorite story in that connection was the day a woman I was dating confessed that, contrary to outward appearances, she had chosen me for my intelligence and was doing all she could be become pregnant by me. I instantly ended the relationship and began to seek a vasectomy. But then the fun began -- most doctors refused to perform the vasectomy because I wasn't already married and I hadn't already had "my children". Others insisted that I had to get my wife's signature -- no wife, no procedure. One doctor initially agreed, then, when he discovered I wasn't a member of a minority group, refused. Finally I met the ultimate western doctor who, on hearing my request, launched into a seemingly rehearsed speech that began, "Your sperm belongs to the state, son." I regretted not recording the conversation for posterity. Then I heard about Planned Parenthood. They gave me a short speech about how the procedure was irreversible, then performed it. Since then, since the vasectomy, on a couple of occasions I've had women say, "I'm late! And I think it's yours! Okay, I might have forgotten just this once to be disciplined about birth control, but haven't you ever been swept up in passion?" That's why I'm a Planned Parenthood supporter. :)
aurelius 13y ago
As a father of three, with #4 on the way, I can get on board with that last sentence. But there's nothing like being married, having kids, and living the constant struggle to be a good husband and a good dad. Having a family will make it painfully obvious what your faults are, and how they affect other people. You will have to face up to those faults, and deal with them. If you don't, it's a disaster. Life certainly is complicated, but the good stuff never comes easy (or cheap). You can stay single, be happy, and hide from yourself. Marriage and kids drags you out of bed and forces you see the light of day.
- lutusp 13y ago
  > You can stay single, be happy, and hide from yourself. Again, I'm not pretending that my choices are for everyone, but I think the case can be persuasively made that an equal number of people hide from themselves by getting married as by staying single. My point is that there are a great number of "right choices", not just one.
  - aurelius 13y ago
    I don't disagree. My point was that choosing to be married and have children is a unique undertaking that is extremely challenging, but a lot of goodness can be gained by submitting to the hard work of being a good spouse and a good parent. Sure, you can shoot it down with counter-examples of bad parenting, bad spouses, bad children, etc.. Still, there's nothing like it, and it's worth speaking about the positive aspects of heterosexual marriage in a forum dominated by, quite frankly, people like you who have an irrational, negative, and hostile attitude towards non-gay marriage and families, to the extreme point where mutilation of your reproductive system is an acceptable choice. Yes, there are a great number of "right choices", but some are objectively better than others. A lot better.
    - lutusp 13y ago
      > Still, there's nothing like it ... Very true, and in the long term, there's nothing but it -- only those who make this choice are represented in the future population. The rest of us live on, not as organisms, but as memes. > Yes, there are a great number of "right choices", but some are objectively better than others. A lot better. Surely you understand that that sentence contradicts itself, yes? If one "right choice" is a lot better than another, this means there's only one right choice -- the choices aren't equivalent, or even comparable. > Still, there's nothing like it, and it's worth speaking about the positive aspects of heterosexual marriage in a forum dominated by, quite frankly, people like you who have an irrational, negative, and hostile attitude towards non-gay marriage and families, to the extreme point where mutilation of your reproductive system is an acceptable choice. Ah -- now I get it: choosing not to have children is mutilation. I read your post out of order, but in sum it makes its point very clearly. To those reading this thread who expressed doubt that there are people who refuse to accept any choice but marriage and children -- hey! I found one, and there are many more.

diminish 13y ago

indeed in earlier societies children were joining the parents in the "serious" part of life earlier than it's the case nowadays. My little 1.5 years old is doing his best to prove he can use a smartphone, tablet, and notebook the way his father uses, alas he can't join me to do the real work i'm doing on emacs. if we were hunter/gatherers i could show him the grown-up life earlier :)