5 ms·

Huh. It's easier to go find an entirely new job than to just knock on your employer's office door and ask to have a quick chat about your compensation? If that

by chasing 13y ago

Huh. It's easier to go find an entirely new job than to just knock on your employer's office door and ask to have a quick chat about your compensation? If that kind of interaction makes you uncomfortable, I guess you probably should go find another job since you might not have a great relationship with your company.

johnnymonster 13y ago
In my experience, the issue that I see is that after asking for a raise or more compensation the response is that "they will look into it". Weeks later, no one gets back to you. At which point its time to move on.
- blueskin_ 13y ago
  A ll too common as a way of ripping people off, unfortunately. Sometimes they are actually trying, if the problem is internal politics preventing paying staff properly, but more often they're hoping you'll either forget about it or leave instead.
  - mcv 13y ago
    Both are good reasons to leave. It doesn't matter if your direct superiors disrespect you, or disrespect is more institutionalized higher up the chain.
zenonu 13y ago
It's not that it's easier, it's that most likely the raise will be 20% minimum, and you're probably looking because of other reasons in addition to the money ("I'm getting paid chump change to deal with this? I'm done"). If you're really good, all it takes is a few phone calls to a recruiter you already know, an interview that week, and your notice on Friday.
- zevyoura 13y ago
  > If you're really good, all it takes is a few phone calls to a recruiter you already know, an interview that week, and your notice on Friday. That sounds like the kind of job hunt that puts you into the exact same position of frustration.
  - flogic 13y ago
    Depends. My best job came from a recruiter. In a larger company, the people who you'll be working with and the people managing the hiring process aren't the same. I'd imagine that transistion takes place the second there is someone to handle HR things. Afterall, the team that's hiring probably wouldn't be hiring if they had time to deal with it.
  - blueskin_ 13y ago
    Not always. That's essentially what I did to get my current job.
genki 13y ago
I think this is somewhat related to the concept of 'managing upwards'. While it might not be hard to tell people "I should be making more money", it should also not be difficult for a good manager to recognize "hey, this guy should be making more money". For me, there would not be a scenario where I'm asking my manager for more money but I'm also satisfied with the relationship with my company, because part of my job satisfaction in relation to my company is recognition of my efforts in the form of salary compensation. I (personally) feel that there's an implicit understanding with my employer, wherein my above and beyond efforts will result in increased compensation. If I feel like I've been clearly outperforming my compensation level and that's not recognized, I'm more likely to search for a new job than to ask for a raise, because my current employer has already failed to meet their end of the bargain.
- alexqgb 13y ago
  This exactly. It IS easier because when it comes to a new company, you've only got one problem - the salary. When it comes to your existing company there are two problems. The money, but also the fact that you're having to ask for it. The more you deserve it the more awkward the conversation becomes since the ask itself is evidence of a management failure. In extreme cases, making the request can be as uncomfortable as having to reapply for a job you've already got. In a well-run shop, managers have a very good idea as to who is worth what, and how much the company stands to lose if they lose good people. Staying one step ahead of this curve is a fundamental part of their jobs as a managers. Obviously, the rules are a bit different in an early-stage start-up where the founders are doing everything at once and hoping something connects. But once an operation has hit cruising altitude, you really shouldn't have to ask for a raise if you're actually worth what your asking.
- jbredizzle 13y ago
  "I (personally) feel that there's an implicit understanding with my employer, wherein my above and beyond efforts will result in increased compensation." Your expectations around compensation should be based on explicit not implicit understandings. Making assumptions about how your emploeyer is going to make decisions about your compensation is not only likely to lead to disappointment, it's a poor way to maximize your salary if that's what you're interested in.
jmspring 13y ago
Simple answer, yes. Most startups will hire (or push for hiring) a "senior person" at the "maximum rate allowed by the board". This includes a mix of stock/yearly comp. Depending on hiring circumstances you can potentially push this. If there is a need, the will find a way to make things work out. Once hired, from the employees perspective, it becomes a game of maintaining expectations. Unfortunately for the employee, in the case of startups (especially early), the expectations are quite high and any extra effort is tied in to the initial offer/hiring agreement. Early stage startups are a gamble. There are often unexpected twists and turns. If you agree to X and Y at time T, three months down the line, the expectations at time U may be much greater. As a non founding employee, your initial contract starts when you join with the expectations around the company when you joined. Carrying those same expectations along the way if the company is not growing in the same manner as you expected is a detriment to yourself. When you realize this, it is time to re-evaluate and decide what is right for your current situation. Does if fit your initial agreement? Then maybe you continue. If it doesn't, you need to consider renegotiating or looking elsewhere...
xaviorm 13y ago
If my employer requires me to come and ask about compensation it means one of two things. a) They don't value the work I am doing. b) I am not doing work that is valuable enough to be noticed. Both options mean it is time to look elsewhere.
dclowd9901 13y ago
Companies aren't interested in negotiating promotions or pay increases anymore. I went from making $30k/year 4 years ago to $200k/year now, and not one time in that course was it from a raise. And people say jumping from job to job looks bad. If it does, I sure as shit haven't seen that side of it.
- blueskin_ 13y ago
  Sadly true. Some companies are willing to keep up, because they don't want to replace employees, but for most, it's cheaper to hire someone underpaid for a year or so until they jump ship, then repeat.
lmm 13y ago
I have a great relationship with my company - I enjoy my job, I get on with my colleagues and my boss - but it's still incredibly socially awkward to ask someone for money. (Whereas interviewing elsewhere means they've offered money first)

by chasing 13y ago

johnnymonster 13y ago

In my experience, the issue that I see is that after asking for a raise or more compensation the response is that "they will look into it". Weeks later, no one gets back to you. At which point its time to move on.

blueskin_ 13y ago
A ll too common as a way of ripping people off, unfortunately. Sometimes they are actually trying, if the problem is internal politics preventing paying staff properly, but more often they're hoping you'll either forget about it or leave instead.
- mcv 13y ago
  Both are good reasons to leave. It doesn't matter if your direct superiors disrespect you, or disrespect is more institutionalized higher up the chain.

zenonu 13y ago

It's not that it's easier, it's that most likely the raise will be 20% minimum, and you're probably looking because of other reasons in addition to the money ("I'm getting paid chump change to deal with this? I'm done"). If you're really good, all it takes is a few phone calls to a recruiter you already know, an interview that week, and your notice on Friday.

zevyoura 13y ago
> If you're really good, all it takes is a few phone calls to a recruiter you already know, an interview that week, and your notice on Friday. That sounds like the kind of job hunt that puts you into the exact same position of frustration.
- flogic 13y ago
  Depends. My best job came from a recruiter. In a larger company, the people who you'll be working with and the people managing the hiring process aren't the same. I'd imagine that transistion takes place the second there is someone to handle HR things. Afterall, the team that's hiring probably wouldn't be hiring if they had time to deal with it.
- blueskin_ 13y ago
  Not always. That's essentially what I did to get my current job.

genki 13y ago

I think this is somewhat related to the concept of 'managing upwards'. While it might not be hard to tell people "I should be making more money", it should also not be difficult for a good manager to recognize "hey, this guy should be making more money". For me, there would not be a scenario where I'm asking my manager for more money but I'm also satisfied with the relationship with my company, because part of my job satisfaction in relation to my company is recognition of my efforts in the form of salary compensation. I (personally) feel that there's an implicit understanding with my employer, wherein my above and beyond efforts will result in increased compensation. If I feel like I've been clearly outperforming my compensation level and that's not recognized, I'm more likely to search for a new job than to ask for a raise, because my current employer has already failed to meet their end of the bargain.

alexqgb 13y ago
This exactly. It IS easier because when it comes to a new company, you've only got one problem - the salary. When it comes to your existing company there are two problems. The money, but also the fact that you're having to ask for it. The more you deserve it the more awkward the conversation becomes since the ask itself is evidence of a management failure. In extreme cases, making the request can be as uncomfortable as having to reapply for a job you've already got. In a well-run shop, managers have a very good idea as to who is worth what, and how much the company stands to lose if they lose good people. Staying one step ahead of this curve is a fundamental part of their jobs as a managers. Obviously, the rules are a bit different in an early-stage start-up where the founders are doing everything at once and hoping something connects. But once an operation has hit cruising altitude, you really shouldn't have to ask for a raise if you're actually worth what your asking.
jbredizzle 13y ago
"I (personally) feel that there's an implicit understanding with my employer, wherein my above and beyond efforts will result in increased compensation." Your expectations around compensation should be based on explicit not implicit understandings. Making assumptions about how your emploeyer is going to make decisions about your compensation is not only likely to lead to disappointment, it's a poor way to maximize your salary if that's what you're interested in.

jmspring 13y ago

Simple answer, yes. Most startups will hire (or push for hiring) a "senior person" at the "maximum rate allowed by the board". This includes a mix of stock/yearly comp. Depending on hiring circumstances you can potentially push this. If there is a need, the will find a way to make things work out. Once hired, from the employees perspective, it becomes a game of maintaining expectations. Unfortunately for the employee, in the case of startups (especially early), the expectations are quite high and any extra effort is tied in to the initial offer/hiring agreement. Early stage startups are a gamble. There are often unexpected twists and turns. If you agree to X and Y at time T, three months down the line, the expectations at time U may be much greater. As a non founding employee, your initial contract starts when you join with the expectations around the company when you joined. Carrying those same expectations along the way if the company is not growing in the same manner as you expected is a detriment to yourself. When you realize this, it is time to re-evaluate and decide what is right for your current situation. Does if fit your initial agreement? Then maybe you continue. If it doesn't, you need to consider renegotiating or looking elsewhere...

xaviorm 13y ago

If my employer requires me to come and ask about compensation it means one of two things. a) They don't value the work I am doing. b) I am not doing work that is valuable enough to be noticed. Both options mean it is time to look elsewhere.

dclowd9901 13y ago

Companies aren't interested in negotiating promotions or pay increases anymore. I went from making $30k/year 4 years ago to $200k/year now, and not one time in that course was it from a raise. And people say jumping from job to job looks bad. If it does, I sure as shit haven't seen that side of it.

blueskin_ 13y ago
Sadly true. Some companies are willing to keep up, because they don't want to replace employees, but for most, it's cheaper to hire someone underpaid for a year or so until they jump ship, then repeat.

lmm 13y ago

I have a great relationship with my company - I enjoy my job, I get on with my colleagues and my boss - but it's still incredibly socially awkward to ask someone for money. (Whereas interviewing elsewhere means they've offered money first)