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But why not the cars? There is no greater symbol of frivolity and privilege than owning and driving a car in the city. Let's be honest the only meaningful publ

But why not the cars? There is no greater symbol of frivolity and privilege than owning and driving a car in the city. Let's be honest the only meaningful public spaces we have in cities are roads and sidewalks, probably 80% of public space. Roads and parking lots together are probably 25+ percent of many cities except New York. Those spaces are as big as they are because of cars. If we didn't have cars, the overwhelming majority of roads would not have to ever have more than one lane in each direction.

protomyth 13y ago
"But why not the cars? There is no greater symbol of frivolity and privilege than owning and driving a car in the city." Does Google supply their people with cars? Do cars use the city bus stops? Most people do not share your "no greater symbol of frivolity and privilege than owning and driving a car in the city" view. Cars are still part of the US's culture. A private bus that uses city stops is seen as a much bigger symbol of privilege than any car. It is a single focus point and can be spun into the "let them eat cake" vibe a protest like this is looking for.
- malandrew 13y ago
  The fact that cars are part of the US culture and identity does not make them any more frivolous and indicative of privilege in any metropolitan area where the public infrastructure is good enough to make the ownership and use of a car a luxury not a requirement. If you own a car in Raleigh, NC or Austin, TX for example, it's part and parcel of living in urban sprawl. The trade off is lower housing costs for greater transportation costs. If you live in NYC and San Francisco, a car is optional unless you make a living in a job that requires frequent daily travel. For everyone else living in a dense urban area it's a luxury that comes at the cost of everyone else since cars compete directly with buses for the use of the commons (roads). I used to live in São Paulo, Brazil, and besides maybe Beijing, PRC (where I also once lived), there is nothing more damaging to the public good than all the people with the money to own and operate private vehicles in a sufficiently populated area that can't really afford having everyone own a car. São Paulo has about 5 million cars in a city of about 20 million. The cars directly compete with buses on the roads and every car hurts the average bus user. Every person who gets sick of buses and buys a cars is screwing over all the people they once shared the bus with making it a little bit worse so that the threshold for getting a car is crossed for a few more people, perpetuating a vicious cycle. There are days when it rains in São Paulo, where the traffic is so bad that it takes 3-4 hours to cross the city in a car. In a bus? I can't even imagine that hellish experience. On the 7th of September for example, 3 million cars will leave the city over the course of like 48 hours, clogging up every major road for hours. I used to go to a place called Maresias on the coast, which is 2.5 hours by car and 4 hours by bus normally without traffic. With traffic it can get as bad as 4-10 hours by car and 6-12 hours by bus. There simply is no mode of transportation more selfish than the car and it is only second in level of privilege to transportation by helicopter.
  - protomyth 13y ago
    Let's see, you are attacking what is a part of accepted US culture calling car drivers selfish and frivolous while missing the whole point of focus of the protest. You are really not going to sound very nice on TV when you are trying to defend against these protests. The retort from some single mother of two who has a car because she needs to drop her children at daycare (not on bus line) and then drive to work because "common" people don't have onsite daycare or fancy buses right to the door will be amusing. I will bet the reporter could even find a more sympathetic story. Bonus if the single mother needed to move farther away from her job because of higher rent. If you think the above is silly and off topic then you are missing the attack vector. Welcome to modern attack politics.
wpietri 13y ago
Because private cars aren't a visible symbol the way the buses are. Seriously, they are giant, shiny, expensive-looking double-decker buses with tinted windows. In my neighborhood I see more of them than city buses.

protomyth 13y ago

"But why not the cars? There is no greater symbol of frivolity and privilege than owning and driving a car in the city." Does Google supply their people with cars? Do cars use the city bus stops? Most people do not share your "no greater symbol of frivolity and privilege than owning and driving a car in the city" view. Cars are still part of the US's culture. A private bus that uses city stops is seen as a much bigger symbol of privilege than any car. It is a single focus point and can be spun into the "let them eat cake" vibe a protest like this is looking for.

malandrew 13y ago
The fact that cars are part of the US culture and identity does not make them any more frivolous and indicative of privilege in any metropolitan area where the public infrastructure is good enough to make the ownership and use of a car a luxury not a requirement. If you own a car in Raleigh, NC or Austin, TX for example, it's part and parcel of living in urban sprawl. The trade off is lower housing costs for greater transportation costs. If you live in NYC and San Francisco, a car is optional unless you make a living in a job that requires frequent daily travel. For everyone else living in a dense urban area it's a luxury that comes at the cost of everyone else since cars compete directly with buses for the use of the commons (roads). I used to live in São Paulo, Brazil, and besides maybe Beijing, PRC (where I also once lived), there is nothing more damaging to the public good than all the people with the money to own and operate private vehicles in a sufficiently populated area that can't really afford having everyone own a car. São Paulo has about 5 million cars in a city of about 20 million. The cars directly compete with buses on the roads and every car hurts the average bus user. Every person who gets sick of buses and buys a cars is screwing over all the people they once shared the bus with making it a little bit worse so that the threshold for getting a car is crossed for a few more people, perpetuating a vicious cycle. There are days when it rains in São Paulo, where the traffic is so bad that it takes 3-4 hours to cross the city in a car. In a bus? I can't even imagine that hellish experience. On the 7th of September for example, 3 million cars will leave the city over the course of like 48 hours, clogging up every major road for hours. I used to go to a place called Maresias on the coast, which is 2.5 hours by car and 4 hours by bus normally without traffic. With traffic it can get as bad as 4-10 hours by car and 6-12 hours by bus. There simply is no mode of transportation more selfish than the car and it is only second in level of privilege to transportation by helicopter.
- protomyth 13y ago
  Let's see, you are attacking what is a part of accepted US culture calling car drivers selfish and frivolous while missing the whole point of focus of the protest. You are really not going to sound very nice on TV when you are trying to defend against these protests. The retort from some single mother of two who has a car because she needs to drop her children at daycare (not on bus line) and then drive to work because "common" people don't have onsite daycare or fancy buses right to the door will be amusing. I will bet the reporter could even find a more sympathetic story. Bonus if the single mother needed to move farther away from her job because of higher rent. If you think the above is silly and off topic then you are missing the attack vector. Welcome to modern attack politics.

wpietri 13y ago

Because private cars aren't a visible symbol the way the buses are. Seriously, they are giant, shiny, expensive-looking double-decker buses with tinted windows. In my neighborhood I see more of them than city buses.