4 ms·

I remember, once, a very cynical person telling me not to call the cops, in any circumstance, unless mine or someone else's survival or long-term well being is

by kremlin 13y ago

I remember, once, a very cynical person telling me not to call the cops, in any circumstance, unless mine or someone else's survival or long-term well being is completely dependent on it. If you see someone shot dead in the street, for example, don't call the cops; leave. You're the first suspect if you do anything else, and you'll be treated like one. I was very put out by this attitude. I'm starting to wonder if it's perhaps quite realistic. I don't know what the cynic would have suggested in this situation. I don't believe he would have said, 'leave her to fend for herself,' but perhaps to call a hospital directly, or ask her to call a family member or something, I don't know. Police are dangerous. They have too much power and not enough brains. I'm an optimist; I think there must be some possible infrastructure that incentivises police to be good, and incentivises everyone in the system to weed out those who are not. The current system doesn't resemble that remotely, and for now, perhaps the cynic is right.

joesmo 13y ago
Your cynical friend was correct. If you have to call 911 for someone else, do it anonymously. As long as police (internal affairs) are the only ones to police police, there will never be any justice. Also, remember that suing police hardly ever works. Police have immunity by law and they use that to their advantage to cover up any cruel and sick acts they feel like. They are above the law. Ask any minority and they will confirm this is the case.
- kylec 13y ago
  I agree. I posted this elsewhere in this thread, but I want to say it again: If police officers are officers of the court, judges should have the authority (and use the authority) to strip the officer of the authority to act as an officer. Much like contempt of court, it should not require formal hearings or process to immediately remove bad officers from duty. At that point the police department would effectively have an ordinary citizen on their payroll, unable to wear a uniform or make arrests or risk being charged with impersonating an officer and kidnapping.
owenjones 13y ago
While I was a student living in a "gentrifying" part of the city, I once went outside to discover my car was full of bullets. Several in the hood, several through the windows, one in the rear tire and most disconcertingly one in the driver side headrest. When I called the police and the investigator came, I could tell I was instantly suspect #1. He began grilling me lengthily about my whereabouts the night before and who I lived with. An officer in blue joined as well and they were basically threatening to confiscate my car until I started talking about getting a lawyer. Of course this situation is nowhere near the authors in terms of harm or even potential harm, but it definitely showed me that ANY interaction with the police has the potential to go VERY badly for you no matter what.
- rayiner 13y ago
  He assumed you were a gang member and the shooting was gang related. Which probably isn't a bad heuristic. Most of the time when gangs shoot up a rival gang members car, they don't accidentally get the wrong one.
  - lhc- 13y ago
    Something tells me that in those cases, the gang members don't usually call the cops to investigate it.
  - jessaustin 13y ago
    Most of the time... Citation needed.
  - owenjones 13y ago
    Doesn't the fact that assumptions like these, when made by the police, can land you in jail or much worse prove the point? What if he also assumed I was lying, drunk or armed?
- bsimpson 13y ago
  Where were you last night? Shooting holes in my own car so I could waste 20 minutes of your time. Why do you ask?
rjd 13y ago
I had two incidents within a year involving members of my family that make me keep cops at a huge distance. First was my father, he was a farmer at the time, late 50s. He found a crop of marijuana on the farm and turned it into the police. The planters of the crop decided that what happened was that my sisters boyfriend must of stolen it to sell. So they drove to my fathers house at dinner time, four of them, and started demanding payment. My sisters boyfriend confronted them and told them what had happened, which then resulted in a four on one beat down. My dad ran back into the house grabbed a bat, ran back out and hit two of them. First guy dropped unconscious with the first blow, second guy stumbled dazed. The last two took off so fast they left the car behind. My mother had rung the police before the violence had started, and they arrived before my sisters boy friend had managed to get off the ground. They arrested my father and he spent the next 3 days in jail. No other charges where laid. Tens of thousands of dollars later the case was thrown out by a jury and the judge scolded the police for there actions and for wasting the courts time and tax payers money. During the proceedings evidence came forward that the police had received the crop, and instead of filing paper work just disposed of it being lazy (the same cop that arrested my father). Before the court the cop was fingered by other police officers as a liar, breaking laws, my family pointed it out, even the four guys fingered the cop as a liar. Official complaints where laid, the response was no wrong doing could be found. A few months after the incident my cousins mates where doing burn outs around, being little bastards really, but the cop couldn't catch them. Angry he went to my cousins house, it was around 3am. Knocked on the door asking where they where. My cousin is also a farmer, gets up around 5am, he opened the door tired and confused. Said he hadn't seen them. The cop got in his face yelling at him, so my cousin said "listen I got work in a few hours and I need some more sleep, they aren't here, you can see that, how about you just fuck off". Which resulted in the cop kicking the door out of his hands and beating my cousin so bad he had to be taken to hospital with a broken jaw, and swelling so bad he couldn't open his eyes. During the beating the cop threatened my cousin, his mates, and father directly. My father, and my family are pillars of the community. My dad grew up in the town, was the local scout master, organises the christmas parades, helps with local stage performances. So the event did not go down well at all. The next bit of what happened is all heresy but this is what I've been told happened. Photos where taken of my cousin. A group of local farmers went to the police station, handed over the photos and said if the cop steps out of line once more he will be lynched (black mail essentially). I've heard variations where they roughed the cop up to send the message to him. He was told he wasn't welcome on any bodies property in the area and to search for a new position immediately. If he failed that then the town was going to turn on his big time, and the photos would be used if an investigation began to make him loose his job. I can remember being in the supermarket on a visit and watching someone eye ball the cop as he was shopping, staring straight down the isle at him, as the cop moved to the next aisle the guy just moved along to the end of that aisle and eye balled him till he left the store. The cop was gone in 6 months, but it took an entire rural community to stand up to him when the police and the complaints organisation wouldn't. You could say there are procedures to deal with these situations, but there aren't when they are design to protect the police. The real sad bit is that prick just moved to another station. He's probably still trying to beat confessions out of kids right now. So I have become a "don't talk to the police" person as well. I don't treat them badly, I smile at them on patrol, but the moment anything starts to get tense I have less than zero trust.

by kremlin 13y ago

joesmo 13y ago

Your cynical friend was correct. If you have to call 911 for someone else, do it anonymously. As long as police (internal affairs) are the only ones to police police, there will never be any justice. Also, remember that suing police hardly ever works. Police have immunity by law and they use that to their advantage to cover up any cruel and sick acts they feel like. They are above the law. Ask any minority and they will confirm this is the case.

kylec 13y ago
I agree. I posted this elsewhere in this thread, but I want to say it again: If police officers are officers of the court, judges should have the authority (and use the authority) to strip the officer of the authority to act as an officer. Much like contempt of court, it should not require formal hearings or process to immediately remove bad officers from duty. At that point the police department would effectively have an ordinary citizen on their payroll, unable to wear a uniform or make arrests or risk being charged with impersonating an officer and kidnapping.

owenjones 13y ago

While I was a student living in a "gentrifying" part of the city, I once went outside to discover my car was full of bullets. Several in the hood, several through the windows, one in the rear tire and most disconcertingly one in the driver side headrest. When I called the police and the investigator came, I could tell I was instantly suspect #1. He began grilling me lengthily about my whereabouts the night before and who I lived with. An officer in blue joined as well and they were basically threatening to confiscate my car until I started talking about getting a lawyer. Of course this situation is nowhere near the authors in terms of harm or even potential harm, but it definitely showed me that ANY interaction with the police has the potential to go VERY badly for you no matter what.

rayiner 13y ago
He assumed you were a gang member and the shooting was gang related. Which probably isn't a bad heuristic. Most of the time when gangs shoot up a rival gang members car, they don't accidentally get the wrong one.
- lhc- 13y ago
  Something tells me that in those cases, the gang members don't usually call the cops to investigate it.
- jessaustin 13y ago
  Most of the time... Citation needed.
- owenjones 13y ago
  Doesn't the fact that assumptions like these, when made by the police, can land you in jail or much worse prove the point? What if he also assumed I was lying, drunk or armed?
bsimpson 13y ago
Where were you last night? Shooting holes in my own car so I could waste 20 minutes of your time. Why do you ask?

rjd 13y ago

I had two incidents within a year involving members of my family that make me keep cops at a huge distance. First was my father, he was a farmer at the time, late 50s. He found a crop of marijuana on the farm and turned it into the police. The planters of the crop decided that what happened was that my sisters boyfriend must of stolen it to sell. So they drove to my fathers house at dinner time, four of them, and started demanding payment. My sisters boyfriend confronted them and told them what had happened, which then resulted in a four on one beat down. My dad ran back into the house grabbed a bat, ran back out and hit two of them. First guy dropped unconscious with the first blow, second guy stumbled dazed. The last two took off so fast they left the car behind. My mother had rung the police before the violence had started, and they arrived before my sisters boy friend had managed to get off the ground. They arrested my father and he spent the next 3 days in jail. No other charges where laid. Tens of thousands of dollars later the case was thrown out by a jury and the judge scolded the police for there actions and for wasting the courts time and tax payers money. During the proceedings evidence came forward that the police had received the crop, and instead of filing paper work just disposed of it being lazy (the same cop that arrested my father). Before the court the cop was fingered by other police officers as a liar, breaking laws, my family pointed it out, even the four guys fingered the cop as a liar. Official complaints where laid, the response was no wrong doing could be found. A few months after the incident my cousins mates where doing burn outs around, being little bastards really, but the cop couldn't catch them. Angry he went to my cousins house, it was around 3am. Knocked on the door asking where they where. My cousin is also a farmer, gets up around 5am, he opened the door tired and confused. Said he hadn't seen them. The cop got in his face yelling at him, so my cousin said "listen I got work in a few hours and I need some more sleep, they aren't here, you can see that, how about you just fuck off". Which resulted in the cop kicking the door out of his hands and beating my cousin so bad he had to be taken to hospital with a broken jaw, and swelling so bad he couldn't open his eyes. During the beating the cop threatened my cousin, his mates, and father directly. My father, and my family are pillars of the community. My dad grew up in the town, was the local scout master, organises the christmas parades, helps with local stage performances. So the event did not go down well at all. The next bit of what happened is all heresy but this is what I've been told happened. Photos where taken of my cousin. A group of local farmers went to the police station, handed over the photos and said if the cop steps out of line once more he will be lynched (black mail essentially). I've heard variations where they roughed the cop up to send the message to him. He was told he wasn't welcome on any bodies property in the area and to search for a new position immediately. If he failed that then the town was going to turn on his big time, and the photos would be used if an investigation began to make him loose his job. I can remember being in the supermarket on a visit and watching someone eye ball the cop as he was shopping, staring straight down the isle at him, as the cop moved to the next aisle the guy just moved along to the end of that aisle and eye balled him till he left the store. The cop was gone in 6 months, but it took an entire rural community to stand up to him when the police and the complaints organisation wouldn't. You could say there are procedures to deal with these situations, but there aren't when they are design to protect the police. The real sad bit is that prick just moved to another station. He's probably still trying to beat confessions out of kids right now. So I have become a "don't talk to the police" person as well. I don't treat them badly, I smile at them on patrol, but the moment anything starts to get tense I have less than zero trust.