6 ms·

Sugar is not the culprit behind all the diseases listed in the article. Obesity is And sugar is culprit behind overeating and obesity.

eclipxe 13y ago
Precisely. Experiment: eat 500 calories of sugar (ice cream, soda, candy). Wait 15-20 minutes, how hungry are you? Now, eat 500 calories of fat (heavy cream, bacon, pork belly, etc). Wait 15-20 minutes, how hungry are you? I've done this experiment a few times now, and without fail, I crave more food after the sugar and can't eat another bite after the fat.
- mishkovski 13y ago
  I can confirm that from my own experience. I lost 20kg in 6 months. Yes I restricted my calorie intake. But how I did that? By controlling my appetite with avoiding carbs especially sugar. Ketogenic diet is powerful tool for restricting calorie intake.
  - eclipxe 13y ago
    Concur. I didn't restrict my calorie intake, and lost 40lbs eating 65% fat, 30% protein and 5% carb. As soon as I add in sugar or other carbohydrates in any capacity, I gain weight and eat much more. On a ketogenic diet I rarely even think about food - I am rarely hungry.
    - sosborn 13y ago
      > I didn't restrict my calorie intake >On a ketogenic diet I rarely even think about food - I am rarely hungry. You probably did lower your caloric intake. The trick is that you did it in a way that it did not bother you. In other words, you ate a healthy diet.
      - jerf 13y ago
        But this is giving away the farm; if the way to eat healthy is a high-fat diet that cuts out the empty carbs (and especially sugar), and then you just naturally eat a healthy amount of food after that without any sort of bizarre calorie counting, that's not proof that "it's all just calories", it proves the exact opposite, that the calorie type matters a lot and conventional nutritional wisdom up to this point on what constitutes a healthy diet is dead wrong. Which it is. But I find it bizarre that people will fall back to this defense, or, at least, I find it bizarre how many people still think this is some sort of defense, when it is in fact the exact, total, polar opposite of the position they think they are defending.
        sosborn 13y ago
        >that's not proof that "it's all just calories", it proves the exact opposite At this point we are just arguing semantics. If you eat fewer calories, regardless of how you accomplish it, you will lose weight. Yes, it is easier to lose weight with healthy diet.
        jerf 13y ago
        The whole line about "it's just calories" is precisely that it does not matter what you eat, it's all just calories. If you agree that it does matter what you eat, it is a fundamentally different position, and it means that, like I said, you are no longer defending the conventional wisdom, you are stipulating the correctness of the attackers, while still confusing yourself into the idea that the original position that you have now stipulated is inaccurate is still somehow true.
        sosborn 13y ago
        You misunderstood me. You can lose weight focusing solely on calories. It is easier to keep your calories in check while eating wholesome foods for numerous reasons, but at the end of the day, the gain/loss is governed by calories.
    - butler14 13y ago
      you didn't KNOWINGLY restrict it, or you upped your calorie expenditure... calories in, calories out.
    - iSnow 13y ago
      OTOH I lost 20Kg eating lots of fruit (evil addictive fructose in there) and no meat. Any one-sided diet can work if your awareness rises. More wholesome diets might even work better in the long run.
      - melfar 13y ago
        How many of those 20 kilos was lost muscle mass? Protein intake is crucial for muscle maintenance. Body cannot synthesize it from either fat or carbs.
      - mamoswined 13y ago
        I can one up everyone. I lost weight on an almost all-fruit diet. And also weight on an almost all-meat diet. What they had in common was simple foods that satiated me and did not impel me to overeat. I've been part of diet communities with keto dieters for awhile and I have met people who have gained weight on keto. These people seem to not be as satiated from things like bacon as more successful keto dieters. I eat a more diverse diet now. I stay away from foods that cause me to overeat like fries.
  - 1qaz2wsx3edc 13y ago
    I've been doing Keto for 5 weeks now, it's an improvement and very easy to follow. Restricting calories is definitely a good way to approach weight loss. I'm so far happy with all the results.
    - butler14 13y ago
      Can you think of any other ways?
    - mamoswined 13y ago
      As long as you get the right amount of calories and nutrients, keto can be healthy long-term, as can veganism. People should chose the diet that works for them. The diet they like enough to follow. For me, keto naturally reduces calories. I'm not the kind of person to overeat bacon or butter. I like them, but I won't overeat them. Whereas when I was vegan I found myself overeating a variety of things.
  - jeffdavis 13y ago
    Lustig is primarily concerned with fructose (and sucrose, which quickly metabolizes into a 50-50 mix of fructose and glucose). Carbs in general (ones that metabolize mostly into glucose) have been widely available for a long time. They are also processed in a more "normal" way than fructose. It might still be a good idea to reduce carbs, but I'm skeptical that the ketogenic diet is healthy.
    - eclipxe 13y ago
      Why skeptical? It has been used for quite a while to treat children with epilepsy. If you're trying to lose weight, it makes sense to avoid things that are uniquely fattening (starches, sugars, etc). Ask anyone that was around before the low-fat fad of the 80's and 90's how you would lose weight - eat less bread, sugar, candy, cake, potatoes, etc.
    - camillomiller 13y ago
      Ketogenic diets are indeed not healthy over prolonged periods and should be limited in time. They're very effective though, so if you wanna do it just seek advice from a nutritionist and keep being supervised. It's like putting the body in emergency mode, something you don't want to do for several weeks at a time. Unfortunately, dieting will not change anything unless you really change your lifestyle and eating habits forever. Any diet is a failure if it's just something you do for some time, just to get back to the old habits once you shaved off some pounds. Because of that, keto diets are not a good solution, since people get the wrong assumption about dieting ("I can eat like an animal and then do some keto to get fit again") and they're very likely to induce some sort of weight cycling (the so called yo-yo effect). Therefore keto should be used with caution, by people who do that with knowledge and with the help of a professional. Sticking to healthier eating habits over time is much more difficult and you need a very, very strong commitment. At some point in time, though, there's a switch that finally clicks and everything becomes more easy. Exercise should be a big part of this journey. In the end it's much more rewarding and you'll discover a whole range of benefits. Weight loss will be just an insignificant detail, then.
      - sgift 13y ago
- jimeuxx 13y ago
  I don't think the idea that junk food is bad for you is surprising to anyone, even if Lustig paints it as a revelation. Have you tried 500 calories worth of apples? The closer people move to actual food and sanity, the further I feel we'll move away from obesity. Rehashed sensationalism helps few other than diet gurus and their brand.
  - eclipxe 13y ago
    How about 500 calories worth of 100% natural apple juice (about 4.5 cups) Try it. Drink it and come back in 15-20 minutes and let me know. Then try 11 slices of pan fried bacon (43 cal/slice according to google) and then tell me how hungry you are in 15-20 minutes.
    - Spoygg 13y ago
      I don't think that is a fair comparison, can you drink fried bacon? Why would you compare liquid juice with hard meal? It is much easier to digest juice, why not just take a kilo of apples (520 calories)?
      - eclipxe 13y ago
        because fiber. Okay, how about half a cup of heavy cream instead of bacon. I guarantee you won't feel hungry 15-20 minutes late.
        deleted 13y ago
        [deleted]
        jimeuxx 13y ago
        All this is fun for experimenting, but none of it proves that we need to remove sugar from our diets. Food is complex and shouldn't be reduced to macronutrients. Maybe the protein in the bacon or the nitrites challenging your bowels contribute to your satiety too. If Lustig's views stop people from pounding soda all the way to the diabetician's office, then great, but if they start putting you off of fruit and vegetables then I think it becomes highly questionable.
- bbosh 13y ago
  Here's another experiment. Eat 500 calories of 50% fat, 50% sugar. For example, ice cream. You'll feel much hungrier than both a fat and sugar only diet. It's fat and sugar combined that cause obesity problems.
  - eclipxe 13y ago
    I agree. Sugar (in some people) can cause the storage of extra calories - if those calories are from fat, it will be stored. Here's another experiment - take 300 million people, tell them to eat primarily carbohydrates and limit their fats. Observe the trend for 30 years.
  - vinceguidry 13y ago
    I eat a pint of ice cream as a meal on rare occasions, it fills me up and I'm only a little hungrier than normal when the next meal time comes round, which I attribute to a pint of ice cream not having as many calories as a typical meal.

eclipxe 13y ago

Precisely. Experiment: eat 500 calories of sugar (ice cream, soda, candy). Wait 15-20 minutes, how hungry are you? Now, eat 500 calories of fat (heavy cream, bacon, pork belly, etc). Wait 15-20 minutes, how hungry are you? I've done this experiment a few times now, and without fail, I crave more food after the sugar and can't eat another bite after the fat.

mishkovski 13y ago
I can confirm that from my own experience. I lost 20kg in 6 months. Yes I restricted my calorie intake. But how I did that? By controlling my appetite with avoiding carbs especially sugar. Ketogenic diet is powerful tool for restricting calorie intake.
- eclipxe 13y ago
  Concur. I didn't restrict my calorie intake, and lost 40lbs eating 65% fat, 30% protein and 5% carb. As soon as I add in sugar or other carbohydrates in any capacity, I gain weight and eat much more. On a ketogenic diet I rarely even think about food - I am rarely hungry.
  - sosborn 13y ago
    > I didn't restrict my calorie intake >On a ketogenic diet I rarely even think about food - I am rarely hungry. You probably did lower your caloric intake. The trick is that you did it in a way that it did not bother you. In other words, you ate a healthy diet.
    - jerf 13y ago
      But this is giving away the farm; if the way to eat healthy is a high-fat diet that cuts out the empty carbs (and especially sugar), and then you just naturally eat a healthy amount of food after that without any sort of bizarre calorie counting, that's not proof that "it's all just calories", it proves the exact opposite, that the calorie type matters a lot and conventional nutritional wisdom up to this point on what constitutes a healthy diet is dead wrong. Which it is. But I find it bizarre that people will fall back to this defense, or, at least, I find it bizarre how many people still think this is some sort of defense, when it is in fact the exact, total, polar opposite of the position they think they are defending.
      - sosborn 13y ago
        >that's not proof that "it's all just calories", it proves the exact opposite At this point we are just arguing semantics. If you eat fewer calories, regardless of how you accomplish it, you will lose weight. Yes, it is easier to lose weight with healthy diet.
        jerf 13y ago
        The whole line about "it's just calories" is precisely that it does not matter what you eat, it's all just calories. If you agree that it does matter what you eat, it is a fundamentally different position, and it means that, like I said, you are no longer defending the conventional wisdom, you are stipulating the correctness of the attackers, while still confusing yourself into the idea that the original position that you have now stipulated is inaccurate is still somehow true.
        sosborn 13y ago
        You misunderstood me. You can lose weight focusing solely on calories. It is easier to keep your calories in check while eating wholesome foods for numerous reasons, but at the end of the day, the gain/loss is governed by calories.
  - butler14 13y ago
    you didn't KNOWINGLY restrict it, or you upped your calorie expenditure... calories in, calories out.
  - iSnow 13y ago
    OTOH I lost 20Kg eating lots of fruit (evil addictive fructose in there) and no meat. Any one-sided diet can work if your awareness rises. More wholesome diets might even work better in the long run.
    - melfar 13y ago
      How many of those 20 kilos was lost muscle mass? Protein intake is crucial for muscle maintenance. Body cannot synthesize it from either fat or carbs.
    - mamoswined 13y ago
      I can one up everyone. I lost weight on an almost all-fruit diet. And also weight on an almost all-meat diet. What they had in common was simple foods that satiated me and did not impel me to overeat. I've been part of diet communities with keto dieters for awhile and I have met people who have gained weight on keto. These people seem to not be as satiated from things like bacon as more successful keto dieters. I eat a more diverse diet now. I stay away from foods that cause me to overeat like fries.
- 1qaz2wsx3edc 13y ago
  I've been doing Keto for 5 weeks now, it's an improvement and very easy to follow. Restricting calories is definitely a good way to approach weight loss. I'm so far happy with all the results.
  - butler14 13y ago
    Can you think of any other ways?
  - mamoswined 13y ago
    As long as you get the right amount of calories and nutrients, keto can be healthy long-term, as can veganism. People should chose the diet that works for them. The diet they like enough to follow. For me, keto naturally reduces calories. I'm not the kind of person to overeat bacon or butter. I like them, but I won't overeat them. Whereas when I was vegan I found myself overeating a variety of things.
- jeffdavis 13y ago
  Lustig is primarily concerned with fructose (and sucrose, which quickly metabolizes into a 50-50 mix of fructose and glucose). Carbs in general (ones that metabolize mostly into glucose) have been widely available for a long time. They are also processed in a more "normal" way than fructose. It might still be a good idea to reduce carbs, but I'm skeptical that the ketogenic diet is healthy.
  - eclipxe 13y ago
    Why skeptical? It has been used for quite a while to treat children with epilepsy. If you're trying to lose weight, it makes sense to avoid things that are uniquely fattening (starches, sugars, etc). Ask anyone that was around before the low-fat fad of the 80's and 90's how you would lose weight - eat less bread, sugar, candy, cake, potatoes, etc.
  - camillomiller 13y ago
    Ketogenic diets are indeed not healthy over prolonged periods and should be limited in time. They're very effective though, so if you wanna do it just seek advice from a nutritionist and keep being supervised. It's like putting the body in emergency mode, something you don't want to do for several weeks at a time. Unfortunately, dieting will not change anything unless you really change your lifestyle and eating habits forever. Any diet is a failure if it's just something you do for some time, just to get back to the old habits once you shaved off some pounds. Because of that, keto diets are not a good solution, since people get the wrong assumption about dieting ("I can eat like an animal and then do some keto to get fit again") and they're very likely to induce some sort of weight cycling (the so called yo-yo effect). Therefore keto should be used with caution, by people who do that with knowledge and with the help of a professional. Sticking to healthier eating habits over time is much more difficult and you need a very, very strong commitment. At some point in time, though, there's a switch that finally clicks and everything becomes more easy. Exercise should be a big part of this journey. In the end it's much more rewarding and you'll discover a whole range of benefits. Weight loss will be just an insignificant detail, then.
    - sgift 13y ago
jimeuxx 13y ago
I don't think the idea that junk food is bad for you is surprising to anyone, even if Lustig paints it as a revelation. Have you tried 500 calories worth of apples? The closer people move to actual food and sanity, the further I feel we'll move away from obesity. Rehashed sensationalism helps few other than diet gurus and their brand.
- eclipxe 13y ago
  How about 500 calories worth of 100% natural apple juice (about 4.5 cups) Try it. Drink it and come back in 15-20 minutes and let me know. Then try 11 slices of pan fried bacon (43 cal/slice according to google) and then tell me how hungry you are in 15-20 minutes.
  - Spoygg 13y ago
    I don't think that is a fair comparison, can you drink fried bacon? Why would you compare liquid juice with hard meal? It is much easier to digest juice, why not just take a kilo of apples (520 calories)?
    - eclipxe 13y ago
      because fiber. Okay, how about half a cup of heavy cream instead of bacon. I guarantee you won't feel hungry 15-20 minutes late.
      - deleted 13y ago
        [deleted]
      - jimeuxx 13y ago
        All this is fun for experimenting, but none of it proves that we need to remove sugar from our diets. Food is complex and shouldn't be reduced to macronutrients. Maybe the protein in the bacon or the nitrites challenging your bowels contribute to your satiety too. If Lustig's views stop people from pounding soda all the way to the diabetician's office, then great, but if they start putting you off of fruit and vegetables then I think it becomes highly questionable.
bbosh 13y ago
Here's another experiment. Eat 500 calories of 50% fat, 50% sugar. For example, ice cream. You'll feel much hungrier than both a fat and sugar only diet. It's fat and sugar combined that cause obesity problems.
- eclipxe 13y ago
  I agree. Sugar (in some people) can cause the storage of extra calories - if those calories are from fat, it will be stored. Here's another experiment - take 300 million people, tell them to eat primarily carbohydrates and limit their fats. Observe the trend for 30 years.
- vinceguidry 13y ago
  I eat a pint of ice cream as a meal on rare occasions, it fills me up and I'm only a little hungrier than normal when the next meal time comes round, which I attribute to a pint of ice cream not having as many calories as a typical meal.