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That's not funny or educational or even interesting. It looks like jealousy or unfounded hate. I can't really think of anything 37signals has done to warrant th

That's not funny or educational or even interesting. It looks like jealousy or unfounded hate. I can't really think of anything 37signals has done to warrant this. They make good products and treat both their employees and customers well. Am I missing something?

raganwald 13y ago
> Am I missing something? Yes. If you went to high school, you may recall a certain type of person: They'd pick someone else, anyone else, and make fun of them for no reason other than to elevate themselves as an arbiter of taste. "Ewww, reg is wearing a bow tie. What a fashion disaster!"
- smrtinsert 13y ago
  Ah yes, when they believed Rails would eat the world.
anon1385 13y ago
>They make good products Do they? That isn't my experience. >treat […] their […] customers well Do they? That isn't my experience.
- coldtea 13y ago
  Isn't it? You don't seem to previde any specifics. Plus, whether it's your experience or not is irrelevant. The general consensus is that they do both. You won't find many people in the industry believing otherwise, not many unsatisfied customers in their forums.
  - anon1385 13y ago
    Most people 'in the industry' don't use their products, they just respect how slick their marketing is and how successful they are at making money.
  - asdasf 13y ago
    >The general consensus is that they do both Your claim is just as baseless as the one you are responding to, which was pointing out how baseless the original claim "they make good software" was. >not many unsatisfied customers in their forums. They heavily censor their forums. I know lots of former customers of theirs who were more than just unsatisfied with them.
    - coldtea 13y ago
      >Your claim is just as baseless as the one you are responding to, which was pointing out how baseless the original claim "they make good software" was. Judging from the fact that their service has good reviews in major media and millions of users, it doesn't sound anywhere near as baseless. >They heavily censor their forums. Any examples? Surely those mythical people know how to save a screenshot, right?
      - asdasf 13y ago
        >Judging from the fact that their service has good reviews in major media and millions of users They have no reviews in major media. They have both good and bad reviews in minor media. The "millions of users" claim is not supported at all. >Any examples? Surely those mythical people know how to save a screenshot, right? Yes, I happen to collect screenshots of things that are well known every time anyone talks to me about anything just in case some random redditard wants proof that the sky is blue.
        coldtea 13y ago
        >They have no reviews in major media. They have both good and bad reviews in minor media. Well, I don't think PC Magazine, for one, is a "minor media" in the IT industry. Or that being called "best" in your category is a "bad review". >The "millions of users" claim is not supported at all. Supported by whom? You mean you don't believe the user numbers they give? Being able to support a 10+ year old company, with 40+ employess, expensive Chicago offices etc, I'd say the "millions of users" claim is just about right. Heck, just a product of Basecamp, Ruby of Rails has had millions of users. Oh, and this Jeff Bezos guy investing in them? I think he knows one thing or two, too. >random redditard OK, this is HN. You can now go back into the woodwork.
- AnotherDesigner 13y ago
  Really? I haven't used Basecamp in years (I work alone most of the time) but last time I did it seemed well thought out and stable. I have read "Getting Real" and have seen a number of their articles they've posted on customer service and taking care of their employees over the years. What have your experiences been?
- jack-r-abbit 13y ago
  > That isn't my experience. That is my experience. Hmmm... I see we have reached an impasse.
- awj 13y ago
  Well, yes, technically when you have no experience with a company or their products "good products and customer service" isn't your experience. Or, you know, you could provide some kind of details.
asdasf 13y ago
>That's not funny or educational or even interesting. Two of those are subjective and I'll ignore. But it is educational, it links to alternatives to 37 signals products. >I can't really think of anything 37signals has done to warrant this The company and its reputation was built on aggressively bad-mouthing and trash-talking anyone and everyone they could. Remember when rails started out? Anyone who dared to like something other than their framework was an idiot (at best).
- scintill76 13y ago
  > The company and its reputation was built on aggressively bad-mouthing and trash-talking anyone and everyone they could. Interesting, this Wired article[0] seems to back up this perception. In this light the 67signals page may be somewhat insightful by parodying the opinionated-jerk rockstar programmer caricature, if a little too mean-spirited and lacking in wit. [0] http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/magazine/16-03/mf_signals?currentPage=all http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/magazine/16-03/mf_signals...
unclebucknasty 13y ago
I used Basecamp a few years back. It was neither horrible nor great in my opinion. But, I don't think the software needs to be bad or they need to mistreat people to be parodied. If you can capture an element of something, then exaggerate it into absurdity. it's parody. Also not so sure about attributing jealousy or hate as the motive here. I mean, it could be, but I just don't know what's on the author's mind (except that he/she clearly believes some things about the company to be absurd). But, it does strike me that the only things worth parodying, for the most part, are those that either succeed or that fail in some very public or fantastic way.

raganwald 13y ago

> Am I missing something? Yes. If you went to high school, you may recall a certain type of person: They'd pick someone else, anyone else, and make fun of them for no reason other than to elevate themselves as an arbiter of taste. "Ewww, reg is wearing a bow tie. What a fashion disaster!"

smrtinsert 13y ago
Ah yes, when they believed Rails would eat the world.

anon1385 13y ago

>They make good products Do they? That isn't my experience. >treat […] their […] customers well Do they? That isn't my experience.

coldtea 13y ago
Isn't it? You don't seem to previde any specifics. Plus, whether it's your experience or not is irrelevant. The general consensus is that they do both. You won't find many people in the industry believing otherwise, not many unsatisfied customers in their forums.
- anon1385 13y ago
  Most people 'in the industry' don't use their products, they just respect how slick their marketing is and how successful they are at making money.
- asdasf 13y ago
  >The general consensus is that they do both Your claim is just as baseless as the one you are responding to, which was pointing out how baseless the original claim "they make good software" was. >not many unsatisfied customers in their forums. They heavily censor their forums. I know lots of former customers of theirs who were more than just unsatisfied with them.
  - coldtea 13y ago
    >Your claim is just as baseless as the one you are responding to, which was pointing out how baseless the original claim "they make good software" was. Judging from the fact that their service has good reviews in major media and millions of users, it doesn't sound anywhere near as baseless. >They heavily censor their forums. Any examples? Surely those mythical people know how to save a screenshot, right?
    - asdasf 13y ago
      >Judging from the fact that their service has good reviews in major media and millions of users They have no reviews in major media. They have both good and bad reviews in minor media. The "millions of users" claim is not supported at all. >Any examples? Surely those mythical people know how to save a screenshot, right? Yes, I happen to collect screenshots of things that are well known every time anyone talks to me about anything just in case some random redditard wants proof that the sky is blue.
      - coldtea 13y ago
        >They have no reviews in major media. They have both good and bad reviews in minor media. Well, I don't think PC Magazine, for one, is a "minor media" in the IT industry. Or that being called "best" in your category is a "bad review". >The "millions of users" claim is not supported at all. Supported by whom? You mean you don't believe the user numbers they give? Being able to support a 10+ year old company, with 40+ employess, expensive Chicago offices etc, I'd say the "millions of users" claim is just about right. Heck, just a product of Basecamp, Ruby of Rails has had millions of users. Oh, and this Jeff Bezos guy investing in them? I think he knows one thing or two, too. >random redditard OK, this is HN. You can now go back into the woodwork.
AnotherDesigner 13y ago
Really? I haven't used Basecamp in years (I work alone most of the time) but last time I did it seemed well thought out and stable. I have read "Getting Real" and have seen a number of their articles they've posted on customer service and taking care of their employees over the years. What have your experiences been?
jack-r-abbit 13y ago
> That isn't my experience. That is my experience. Hmmm... I see we have reached an impasse.
awj 13y ago
Well, yes, technically when you have no experience with a company or their products "good products and customer service" isn't your experience. Or, you know, you could provide some kind of details.

asdasf 13y ago

>That's not funny or educational or even interesting. Two of those are subjective and I'll ignore. But it is educational, it links to alternatives to 37 signals products. >I can't really think of anything 37signals has done to warrant this The company and its reputation was built on aggressively bad-mouthing and trash-talking anyone and everyone they could. Remember when rails started out? Anyone who dared to like something other than their framework was an idiot (at best).

scintill76 13y ago
> The company and its reputation was built on aggressively bad-mouthing and trash-talking anyone and everyone they could. Interesting, this Wired article[0] seems to back up this perception. In this light the 67signals page may be somewhat insightful by parodying the opinionated-jerk rockstar programmer caricature, if a little too mean-spirited and lacking in wit. [0] http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/magazine/16-03/mf_signals?currentPage=all http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/magazine/16-03/mf_signals...

unclebucknasty 13y ago

I used Basecamp a few years back. It was neither horrible nor great in my opinion. But, I don't think the software needs to be bad or they need to mistreat people to be parodied. If you can capture an element of something, then exaggerate it into absurdity. it's parody. Also not so sure about attributing jealousy or hate as the motive here. I mean, it could be, but I just don't know what's on the author's mind (except that he/she clearly believes some things about the company to be absurd). But, it does strike me that the only things worth parodying, for the most part, are those that either succeed or that fail in some very public or fantastic way.