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FiftyThree just posted this on Twitter: .@daringfireball please don’t take the bait. Paper by miSoft V1 was launched Sep 20th 2012, 5 month after us. https://

by Aaronn 13y ago

FiftyThree just posted this on Twitter: .@daringfireball please don’t take the bait. Paper by miSoft V1 was launched Sep 20th 2012, 5 month after us. https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430845528805756928 https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430845528805756928

k-mcgrady 13y ago
Wasn't their point that they registered the name Paper with Apple before anyone else? You can register an app name and have it held for a couple months I think before actually launching.
- hrktb 13y ago
  If someone registers the name but it appears nowhere on the store, the name + some string is OK and an existing app can change to the same name and get published in the meantime, it's basically as if there is no name registration.
- bennyg 13y ago
  You have 180 days after registering the name to use it - and then you can never register that name again under that developer account.
  - rbritton 13y ago
    There's a loophole. If you register it, submit a binary, and then reject the binary you get unlimited time.
    - bennyg 13y ago
      That's actually awesome to know. I've lost an amazing name because of this - and wish I still had it.
- gorner 13y ago
  That doesn't make a difference for trademark rights though. Priority for trademark rights would be based on the first date the name was actually used on an available product/service – or, at the very least, the date an intent-to-use trademark application was filed (which MiSoft does not appear to have done) – NOT the first date it was thought of or worked on.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]
Greenisus 13y ago
That's interesting but I'm not sure launch date should be the date that determines when it's fair for you to have a name. FiftyThree's Paper is no doubt the better one (I was at WWDC and applauded them when they won their ADA), but some apps take a very long time to build. While you're building your masterpiece, some bozo could start and finish a lesser app and use your name before you have a chance to do anything about it.
- rikf 13y ago
  If your apps biggest selling point is that its named after a commonly used noun then I think you have problems. Its a similar concept to idea vs execution. We saw the same thing at the start of the internet revolution with domain squatting.
- gorner 13y ago
  If they (MiSoft) had filed a trademark application for "Paper" around the same time they reserved the name with Apple, they might have a case. But reserving a name with a retailer – without actually using it, and without anyone (other than Apple) knowing you were planning to use it – would not to my knowledge have any legal effect with regards to usage rights.
interpol_p 13y ago
I remember when Paper by FiftyThree first came out, I went to the App Store and searched for "Paper". The first result was some other simple drawing app called "Paper" (not miSoft's). There was definitely a "Paper" app in the App Store, for drawing, before Paper by FiftyThree.
- julianwa 13y ago
  Disclaimer: I'm a co-founder at FiftyThree Just a few facts: 1. "Paper", an app from developer "Contradictory", has existed in the App Store since October 27, 2011. This is presumably before miSoft registered their Paper. (https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430873195097632769 https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430873195097632769) Contradictory is clearly a name squatter. 2. miSoft's Paper launched ~5 months after Paper by FiftyThree. (https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430845528805756928 https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430845528805756928) 3. miSoft renamed another of their apps "Kid Paint" to "Paper Express" on 12/20/2012 after FiftyThree won App of the Year (https://twitter.com/georgpetschnigg/status/430916319006167040/photo/1 https://twitter.com/georgpetschnigg/status/43091631900616704...)
  - interpol_p 13y ago
    Thanks for your reply. I have no problems with your name (and I'm in love with your app, Paper). But on your release day I did come across another app called "Paper" that I actually downloaded by mistake because App Store search is so bad it hadn't indexed "Paper by FiftyThree" yet. I can't find it anymore, but the icon was very simple, a plain white A4 piece of paper on a blue background. I assume this app existed on the store before yours because I managed to accidentally download it on your release day. When a name is generic like Paper I think it's okay to have multiple apps on the App Store.

by Aaronn 13y ago

k-mcgrady 13y ago

Wasn't their point that they registered the name Paper with Apple before anyone else? You can register an app name and have it held for a couple months I think before actually launching.

hrktb 13y ago
If someone registers the name but it appears nowhere on the store, the name + some string is OK and an existing app can change to the same name and get published in the meantime, it's basically as if there is no name registration.
bennyg 13y ago
You have 180 days after registering the name to use it - and then you can never register that name again under that developer account.
- rbritton 13y ago
  There's a loophole. If you register it, submit a binary, and then reject the binary you get unlimited time.
  - bennyg 13y ago
    That's actually awesome to know. I've lost an amazing name because of this - and wish I still had it.
gorner 13y ago
That doesn't make a difference for trademark rights though. Priority for trademark rights would be based on the first date the name was actually used on an available product/service – or, at the very least, the date an intent-to-use trademark application was filed (which MiSoft does not appear to have done) – NOT the first date it was thought of or worked on.

deleted 13y ago

[deleted]

Greenisus 13y ago

That's interesting but I'm not sure launch date should be the date that determines when it's fair for you to have a name. FiftyThree's Paper is no doubt the better one (I was at WWDC and applauded them when they won their ADA), but some apps take a very long time to build. While you're building your masterpiece, some bozo could start and finish a lesser app and use your name before you have a chance to do anything about it.

rikf 13y ago
If your apps biggest selling point is that its named after a commonly used noun then I think you have problems. Its a similar concept to idea vs execution. We saw the same thing at the start of the internet revolution with domain squatting.
gorner 13y ago
If they (MiSoft) had filed a trademark application for "Paper" around the same time they reserved the name with Apple, they might have a case. But reserving a name with a retailer – without actually using it, and without anyone (other than Apple) knowing you were planning to use it – would not to my knowledge have any legal effect with regards to usage rights.

interpol_p 13y ago

I remember when Paper by FiftyThree first came out, I went to the App Store and searched for "Paper". The first result was some other simple drawing app called "Paper" (not miSoft's). There was definitely a "Paper" app in the App Store, for drawing, before Paper by FiftyThree.

julianwa 13y ago
Disclaimer: I'm a co-founder at FiftyThree Just a few facts: 1. "Paper", an app from developer "Contradictory", has existed in the App Store since October 27, 2011. This is presumably before miSoft registered their Paper. (https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430873195097632769 https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430873195097632769) Contradictory is clearly a name squatter. 2. miSoft's Paper launched ~5 months after Paper by FiftyThree. (https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430845528805756928 https://twitter.com/FiftyThree/status/430845528805756928) 3. miSoft renamed another of their apps "Kid Paint" to "Paper Express" on 12/20/2012 after FiftyThree won App of the Year (https://twitter.com/georgpetschnigg/status/430916319006167040/photo/1 https://twitter.com/georgpetschnigg/status/43091631900616704...)
- interpol_p 13y ago
  Thanks for your reply. I have no problems with your name (and I'm in love with your app, Paper). But on your release day I did come across another app called "Paper" that I actually downloaded by mistake because App Store search is so bad it hadn't indexed "Paper by FiftyThree" yet. I can't find it anymore, but the icon was very simple, a plain white A4 piece of paper on a blue background. I assume this app existed on the store before yours because I managed to accidentally download it on your release day. When a name is generic like Paper I think it's okay to have multiple apps on the App Store.