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It's a question of comparative damage. What's worse, shutting down the NSA (remember, the FBI, CIA, etc, are still completely operational), or leaving it funct

It's a question of comparative damage. What's worse, shutting down the NSA (remember, the FBI, CIA, etc, are still completely operational), or leaving it functioning with the damage it does to our democracy? Given that the NSA has lately been justifying its existence by all that terror it stops, and then has been able to give exactly one case where its investigations have led to something (i.e., that one guy who was sending $8k to a terrorist body), and there is zero transparency into anything else it does...I'm extremely okay with it shutting down their data centers until such a time as the court system stops giving them a pass.

tptacek 13y ago
The CIA relies on NSA for SIGINT, and NSA on CIA for human intelligence.
- CamperBob2 13y ago
  The CIA should not be relying on NSA intercepts for domestic subjects, since they (the CIA) are not even supposed to operate domestically. I see no reason in the world to let these people continue to violate their own charters as well as the Fourth Amendment with total impunity. Cut off their air supply as well as their water supply, and I'll take my chances with the terrorists.
  - tptacek 13y ago
    I agree that the CIA shouldn't be doing domestic intelligence work, but that's not relevant to the argument upthread, which suggests that the NSA could be shut down without crippling foreign intelligence because the CIA would continue to operate.
  - BrainInAJar 13y ago
    > The CIA should not be relying on NSA intercepts for domestic subjects, since they (the CIA) are not even supposed to operate domestically. Yeah, they should go back to the old days when CSIS & MI6 spied on Americans and shared the knowledge with the CIA, and vice-versa
    - jkestner 13y ago
      The old days? Isn't this what the Five Eyes partners are doing for each other now? Now or then, it's breaking the intent of the law. If we mean to spy on our citizens, then dadgumit, state it explicitly.

tptacek 13y ago

The CIA relies on NSA for SIGINT, and NSA on CIA for human intelligence.

CamperBob2 13y ago
The CIA should not be relying on NSA intercepts for domestic subjects, since they (the CIA) are not even supposed to operate domestically. I see no reason in the world to let these people continue to violate their own charters as well as the Fourth Amendment with total impunity. Cut off their air supply as well as their water supply, and I'll take my chances with the terrorists.
- tptacek 13y ago
  I agree that the CIA shouldn't be doing domestic intelligence work, but that's not relevant to the argument upthread, which suggests that the NSA could be shut down without crippling foreign intelligence because the CIA would continue to operate.
- BrainInAJar 13y ago
  > The CIA should not be relying on NSA intercepts for domestic subjects, since they (the CIA) are not even supposed to operate domestically. Yeah, they should go back to the old days when CSIS & MI6 spied on Americans and shared the knowledge with the CIA, and vice-versa
  - jkestner 13y ago
    The old days? Isn't this what the Five Eyes partners are doing for each other now? Now or then, it's breaking the intent of the law. If we mean to spy on our citizens, then dadgumit, state it explicitly.