7 ms·

It's very difficult to imagine an American company doing this, especially in the face of declining revenue. American corporations have a ways to go when it come

It's very difficult to imagine an American company doing this, especially in the face of declining revenue. American corporations have a ways to go when it comes to treating employees like human beings rather than resources.

pjmlp 13y ago
As European, I have been always put off by the work conditions there.
- zura 13y ago
  On the other hand, 6 figures salary is as well a rarity in Euros (in EUR currency countries) for engineers. EDIT: I should had put more emphasis on "rarity" - lets say almost unimaginable. At least, I have an impression that it is much more common in USA.
  - hatred 13y ago
    Well a quick multiplier of 1.35 means $135k in USD yearly for a 6 figure salary. Well that's a rarity even for software developers here in US unless you are pretty darn good. BTW, how much is the average salary paid by american companies in Europe ?
    - OhHeyItsE 13y ago
      I would say that's middle-of-the road for an experienced engineer in NYC. Location is everything, I suppose.
  - gordaco 13y ago
    Speaking as another European who has always been put off by the usual American conditions, money is not a very big concern to me beyond my (admittedly quite frugal) standard of living. Time is a far, far, far more important resource, and working in the USA seems to include insane hours and constant overtime and few vacations. Also, I think you don't need that much money in Europe, thanks to things like socialized healthcare.
    - sudomal 13y ago
      Agreed. As you get older too, you start to appreciate how much time is burned by working. It's good to work, just it shouldn't dominate your waking life.
    - Pxtl 13y ago
      Your forgot to include nightmarish commutes in your list of North American time-vampires.
    - _random_ 13y ago
      Also food companies are allowed to do way more dodgy stuff in USA. E.g. M&Ms can't even sell their peanut-butter version in UK because of additives.
  - pjmlp 13y ago
    My time on earth with the ones I love, is more important than money.
  - qwerta 13y ago
    Not really. In many EU countries it is about 3x of average salary.
  - bosie 13y ago
    living costs are much lower though, at least in the parts of the US where 100k are common. besides, what do you count as 'salary'? companies pay into the 401k and the social security, doesn't show up in the salary though. and they pay quite a bit depending on the actual salary.
- badman_ting 13y ago
  Me too, except I lived here all my life.
graving 13y ago
I agree, the comparable layoffs in the US would be the thousands of Motorola layoffs after the Google takeover. Haven't really come across anything coming out of them like in the story.
jbuzbee 13y ago
There are multiple ways to look at this. In one respect, you could say that this generous "easing redundant employes out the door" policy hurts the company and the employees still in place as it diverts money that could be spent keeping the company in business by refining existing products and developing new ones. If the company goes under, everybody is hurt. And if you're not careful, your employees that can help the company the most may try to get laid off in order to fund their side projects. On the other-hand, morale must be terrible at places like Nokia and Blackberry right now. Programs like this help the company as it creates loyalty and helps keep good employees in place as they know that there will be assistance if they do get laid off. But once again, it could create or hasten a death-spiral. Employees can see that these layoff programs are expensive so they may bail out to get theirs before the money runs out. Tough times. Touch choices.
- michaelt 13y ago
  Well, one of the costs of hiring and having employees is you have to ringfence some money for redundancy payments. This is a completely predictable expense - a company shouldn't be put out of business by paying redundancy money any more than they should go out of business when the electricity bill comes in or the printer needs a new toner cartridge.
- gaius 13y ago
  Another way to look at it is seeding the ecosystem to create new markets over the long term. Nokia knows about pivoting. Before they made phones, they made rubber boots!
bananacurve 13y ago
They lost 40% of their revenue in mobile phones in Q2 2013. It is amazing they retained any composure at all after being so thoroughly crushed.
michaelochurch 13y ago
The old Silicon Valley was this way. Hewlett-Packard did a 10% across-the-board pay cut and gave non-executive employees a day off every 2 weeks. If a startup had to cut staff, the people were let go with great references and introduced to investors so they could try their own startups. Even when people had to be let go, management would make sure it helped their careers in the long run... because Silicon Valley was still a world in which the little guy mattered. The new Valley isn't that way, and that's actually a bit dangerous. I know someone who was let go from a startup, not given investor contact (or even a severance package) and he pretty much destroyed the place.
- at-fates-hands 13y ago
  I can confirm this. I had several family members work at Intel in the early 80's. I remember the stories about how Intel was known to really take care of their employees, even after they left the company.

pjmlp 13y ago

As European, I have been always put off by the work conditions there.

zura 13y ago
On the other hand, 6 figures salary is as well a rarity in Euros (in EUR currency countries) for engineers. EDIT: I should had put more emphasis on "rarity" - lets say almost unimaginable. At least, I have an impression that it is much more common in USA.
- hatred 13y ago
  Well a quick multiplier of 1.35 means $135k in USD yearly for a 6 figure salary. Well that's a rarity even for software developers here in US unless you are pretty darn good. BTW, how much is the average salary paid by american companies in Europe ?
  - OhHeyItsE 13y ago
    I would say that's middle-of-the road for an experienced engineer in NYC. Location is everything, I suppose.
- gordaco 13y ago
  Speaking as another European who has always been put off by the usual American conditions, money is not a very big concern to me beyond my (admittedly quite frugal) standard of living. Time is a far, far, far more important resource, and working in the USA seems to include insane hours and constant overtime and few vacations. Also, I think you don't need that much money in Europe, thanks to things like socialized healthcare.
  - sudomal 13y ago
    Agreed. As you get older too, you start to appreciate how much time is burned by working. It's good to work, just it shouldn't dominate your waking life.
  - Pxtl 13y ago
    Your forgot to include nightmarish commutes in your list of North American time-vampires.
  - _random_ 13y ago
    Also food companies are allowed to do way more dodgy stuff in USA. E.g. M&Ms can't even sell their peanut-butter version in UK because of additives.
- pjmlp 13y ago
  My time on earth with the ones I love, is more important than money.
- qwerta 13y ago
  Not really. In many EU countries it is about 3x of average salary.
- bosie 13y ago
  living costs are much lower though, at least in the parts of the US where 100k are common. besides, what do you count as 'salary'? companies pay into the 401k and the social security, doesn't show up in the salary though. and they pay quite a bit depending on the actual salary.
badman_ting 13y ago
Me too, except I lived here all my life.

graving 13y ago

I agree, the comparable layoffs in the US would be the thousands of Motorola layoffs after the Google takeover. Haven't really come across anything coming out of them like in the story.

jbuzbee 13y ago

There are multiple ways to look at this. In one respect, you could say that this generous "easing redundant employes out the door" policy hurts the company and the employees still in place as it diverts money that could be spent keeping the company in business by refining existing products and developing new ones. If the company goes under, everybody is hurt. And if you're not careful, your employees that can help the company the most may try to get laid off in order to fund their side projects. On the other-hand, morale must be terrible at places like Nokia and Blackberry right now. Programs like this help the company as it creates loyalty and helps keep good employees in place as they know that there will be assistance if they do get laid off. But once again, it could create or hasten a death-spiral. Employees can see that these layoff programs are expensive so they may bail out to get theirs before the money runs out. Tough times. Touch choices.

michaelt 13y ago
Well, one of the costs of hiring and having employees is you have to ringfence some money for redundancy payments. This is a completely predictable expense - a company shouldn't be put out of business by paying redundancy money any more than they should go out of business when the electricity bill comes in or the printer needs a new toner cartridge.
gaius 13y ago
Another way to look at it is seeding the ecosystem to create new markets over the long term. Nokia knows about pivoting. Before they made phones, they made rubber boots!

bananacurve 13y ago

They lost 40% of their revenue in mobile phones in Q2 2013. It is amazing they retained any composure at all after being so thoroughly crushed.

michaelochurch 13y ago

The old Silicon Valley was this way. Hewlett-Packard did a 10% across-the-board pay cut and gave non-executive employees a day off every 2 weeks. If a startup had to cut staff, the people were let go with great references and introduced to investors so they could try their own startups. Even when people had to be let go, management would make sure it helped their careers in the long run... because Silicon Valley was still a world in which the little guy mattered. The new Valley isn't that way, and that's actually a bit dangerous. I know someone who was let go from a startup, not given investor contact (or even a severance package) and he pretty much destroyed the place.

at-fates-hands 13y ago
I can confirm this. I had several family members work at Intel in the early 80's. I remember the stories about how Intel was known to really take care of their employees, even after they left the company.