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The level of denial of the problem in this thread is astounding. It will only exacerbate the issue. We are not heroes out of an Ayn Rand novel. We don't live i

• BlackDeath3 13y ago
  What a convincing post.
• smtddr 13y ago
  The future: http://i.imgur.com/lkdFZMi.png http://i.imgur.com/lkdFZMi.png It's just like another comment(can't find it right now) said in an earlier story. Techies are turning into the new Bank execs. Greed[1] is taking over; screw anyone/anything that tries to stop us. At this rate, tech people will be in high-security gated communities while everyone outside suffers from being displaced with no plan on how to keep them busy & happy. All the denial & excuses you're reading I'm sure also exist in the minds of Bank/Oil/megacorp execs too. 1. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7067812 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7067812
• corresation 13y ago
  This growing strategy of doing a top post that purports to respond to caricatures of other people is tiring, but is increasingly common (I would wager that an average depth query for HN posts would show a strong trend towards decreasing). Yes, someone said the post is hyperbolic drivel. You can argue subjectively whether that is true or not, but simply calling it "denial" is not a credible way of responding to it. And FWIW...public enemy #1? Linkbait garbage. The "hero tech genius of SV" remains an absolutely common media story, and SV companies remain among the most respected and adored names. Comparing them with banks, or claiming that they're perceived as a public enemy, is indeed, hyperbolic drivel. Some people protested a bus in San Francisco. Cue hysterics and gross-overreactions.
  • alecco 13y ago
    Society is starting to get tired of the tech industry exceptionalism. You see it in many places, off-line.
    • avn2109 13y ago
      Society outside of NYC/SF/a few other places has never heard of the tech industry or it's exceptionalism. The middle of the country doesn't know that we exist. And in NY, our claims of grandeur are drowned out by the overwhelming swagger of the finance guys.
      • aryastark 13y ago
        On what planet do you live on? You make it sound like the midwest is riding around in buggy whips and without electricity. You really think people haven't seen The Social Network? That entire movie was about the arrogance of Zuckerberg and what a special little snowflake he was.
      • Crito 13y ago
        My parents thought that "Silicon Valley" was "that 90's thing". Many Americans haven't paid attention to it or heard about it since the dot-com burst. I have also several times encountered the idea that "there are no more software jobs, they all went overseas". Of course that has no basis in reality, but that is one of the themes about the tech industry that is perpetuated by various forms of media.
        • Crake 13y ago
          >"I have also several times encountered the idea that "there are no more software jobs, they all went overseas". Of course that has no basis in reality, but that is one of the themes about the tech industry that is perpetuated by various forms of media." One of the smarter guys in my physics class was convinced that programming was a dead end career. I was perplexed since he read a lot of science and tech news and seemed pretty up to date on things in general.
      • 13y ago
• benihana 13y ago
  >Or you can keep aiming for 6-figure salaries with a sports car. And a bottle of anti-depressants. I was with you until you brought out this incredibly smug false dichotomy, and this presumption with the anti-depressants. Up until this sentence, you were making a solid point but you injected your personal feelings into it right there. There is nothing that says you can't make 6 figures, drive a sports car, and still give back and be happy. The notion that anyone who enjoys spending the money they've earned is popping anti-depressants and trying to find meaning in their lives is just as bad as comparing progressivism to nazism mentioned in the article it just goes in the opposite direction.
  • alecco 13y ago
    My point was on the focus on getting rich or die trying. I have absolutely no problem with big salaries for people with a balanced mindset and life. But this combination is a rare thing in technology. Big salaries most usually require being a workaholic.
    • strlen 13y ago
      > I have absolutely no problem with big salaries for people with a balanced mindset and life. First, saying that Silicon Valley's housing and inequality is caused by technologists "getting rich or dying trying" seems gravely wrong. Second, many professionals find their work intrinsically fulfilling and enjoyable. Not everyone works just for money or to fill an some kind of an unhealthy addiction. Postdocs and graduate students often work a great deal harder for a lot less. You're also assuming an even more atomized society than anything Rand could imagine: most people understand that for them alone utility of wealth is a step function, they don't need to be told that. Yet, they want their kids to attend good schools, which means means paying outlandish prices for a tiny home in a good school district (in most of Bay Area counties schools are assigned by residence) or even more for a private school. They also don't want to jeopardize their families with the kind of pay-check to pay-check existence that leads to disaster when one of the dual earners loses their income. Is this morally right? No, Silicon Valley has deep housing problems (geography, failure to build upwards, zoning, and other regulations) and the entire state's education system is a nightmare. Yet as much as we'd like these problems to go away, this is the reality and we can't avoid it for the time being. It's also great that folks like Bill Gates exist, for whom achievement is not a step function. As a Linux/BSD user I hated his guts as Microsoft CEO, but his non-profit work has been nothing short of amazing. He could have easily taken "f u money" decades ago and retired to a middle-class lifestyle with some angel investing on the side. Yet he amassed a fortune long after it ceased to bring him any _personal_ benefit: he chose to use it to pursue even more ambitious projects that benefit everyone. I'm not in any way saying that private non-profits make government investment un-needed -- the Internet, immense achievements in aerospace, etc... are but a few examples of public sphere producing great things. Even Peter Thiel has admitted as much in recent interviews. Yet, public investment in hard problems is obviously not mutually exclusive with private enterprise either.
• eli_gottlieb 13y ago
  >Or you can keep aiming for 6-figure salaries with a sports car. And a bottle of anti-depressants. Excuse me, I want everyone to have six figures and a sports car. Yes, I realize this is not ecologically feasible, but other than that I don't see anything inherently wrong with being quite comfortable, as long as you do so in a basically egalitarian society.
  • alecco 13y ago
    You guys are missing the point, "aiming", the industry's carrot to overwork yourselves for the startup lottery and forget about the rest. http://www.jwz.org/blog/2011/11/watch-a-vc-use-my-name-to-sell-a-con/ http://www.jwz.org/blog/2011/11/watch-a-vc-use-my-name-to-se... (ironically bashing TC)
    • eli_gottlieb 13y ago
      Saying that I miss the point would imply that I actually buy into the con in the first place. I have much better things to do with my time than that.
    • Crito 13y ago
      There are much easier ways to make 6-figures than playing the startup lottery. (I mean, unless perhaps we are considering multi-billion dollar businesses that happen to be located in California to be "startups").
    • strlen 13y ago
      Neither a six figure salary nor a sports car require winning the startup lottery or overwork. Nor do sports cars require six figure salaries: case-in-point, a good condition used Honda S2000 can be had for under $10,000 if not under $5,000 these days. Nor are startups lottery tickets: people tend to overvalue equity at early startups, but tend to undervalue it at mature and well established ones (the equity percentage may be smaller, but the chance of that equity becoming liquid and appreciating is higher).
• argumentum 13y ago
  The level of self-hatred in your post is astounding. You seem to identify the problem as a lack of empathy on the part of "we, techies". You should speak for yourself on that one, as I (and probably most others here) feel no sense of belonging to your "we, techies". For many here, technology is the means by which we express our empathy: what is a startup if not a recognition of and solution to a human problem. 1. I don't see anyone here claiming to be a Randian hero or that we live in a simple society, quite the opposite. It seems to be you claiming that "youth unemployment" and other "social issues" are (simply) our fault and things that we can fix on our own. 2. For all the hate that AirBnB is getting (both in the article and this comment thread), it has provided income, housing and friendships to countless unemployed youth, many of whom lack the credit to sign a lease. Countless more have been able to keep their homes because of AirBnB. In response to Hurricane Sandy, AirBnB did this: https://www.airbnb.com/sandy https://www.airbnb.com/sandy (wow, corporate profits and social good going hand in hand, who'd have thought). Perhaps they should pay the hotel tax in some jurisdictions, perhaps they would do better to comply with some regulations (most of which were intended for commercial properties, not a guy renting out his extra room to make rent). But lets not overlook the overwhelming good that AirBnB has done for so many, including myself. 3. One constant in this community (hacker news) has been the promotion of a free internet where users are in charge. The techcrunch article you say "we" deny implicitly suggests limits on the freedom of the internet: it's anti-bitcoin, anti-sharing economy etc. These are things made possible only by a free internet, which is threatened (mostly) not by our industry but by telecoms, hollywood & by extension the government. 4. Technology is not some trifling thing that is "created" by recent public or private financing. It's the legacy of over a million years of cultural evolution from before we were even a species. If anything, we owe it to our ancestors to continue the great human experiment, to keep learning about our environment (science) and how to control it (technology) to create better lives for ourselves and those who follow us (social development). 5. Yes, many of us (including myself), believe the free market is a important tool to achieve this* . Other ways we contribute are furthering Science, Art and Sport. Yet another tool is voluntary charity. And yes, another is political action through the government. * It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we can expect our dinner, but from their regard to their own interest - Adam Smith
• Crake 13y ago
  The anti-depressants comment was unnecessary. SSRIs are most effective when used in non-situational induced depression anyway.