4 ms·

After moving to California 3 years ago I've seen stretches of Utah, Arizona, Nevada, Idaho, and of course California I'd never have seen without a car. Gotten

by base698 13y ago

After moving to California 3 years ago I've seen stretches of Utah, Arizona, Nevada, Idaho, and of course California I'd never have seen without a car. Gotten to go to places impractical with any other transportation. I can't really imagine not having a car for my weekend trips. I get not wanting to stay in a car for 40 minutes each way on a weekly commute, but being trapped in a city like LA or San Francisco with no access to the boundless natural beauty and adventure would cause me to go nuts. Hipster coffee shops and artisanal food only do so much for my sanity.

fit2rule 13y ago
I'm not saying you shouldn't drive your car everywhere. I am saying, you shouldn't be doing it every day. That, right there, is one of the unhealthiest lifestyles, for everyone. The average American spends an hour a day in their car. This number changes over the years, of course, but generally Americans spend a large portion of their lives, consuming gas. Its just built into the nations life-lines at this point. Weekend trips with the car would be great! Alas, thats not how America uses its cars ..
- josefresco 13y ago
  Can you share the source for the data on how much time the average American spends in a car?
  - ricardobeat 13y ago
    A quick google search points to an even higher average (101 minutes), in 2006: https://web.archive.org/web/20100526113417/http://www.revolutionhealth.com/blogs/drscherger/men-moderate-exercis-3815 https://web.archive.org/web/20100526113417/http://www.revolu...
- reckoner13 13y ago
  The thing is the infrastructure has been long established where the transition to more commuters using public transit is going to take a long time. In LA, they are putting in more public transit options, but the reality is most people commute too long of distances to their jobs for it to be practical to utilize it. So, these options will only be practical for a small population. Otherwise, your options are: 1) Drive an hour in traffic or 2) Spend 3+ hours on public transit (but in a cramped bus). What's your pick for the daily? This also limits your freedom (yep I said it.) to get groceries or do other errands with the little time you have after work which would add additional time to your commute. Are you American? Your perspective seems a little overgeneralized than reality. Don't get me wrong gas consumption is certainly an issue here. Hopefully Tesla drives the auto industry in the right direction.
- justathrow2k 13y ago
  One hour a day (on average) hardly seems like a LARGE portion of one's life. Surely, it adds up, but lets say you average being awake 15 hours a day, that's 1/15th of one's life. Not large in my opinion, and certainly no where close to being a majority. An aside...personally, I spend...8 minutes (or less ) in a car each day.
vellum 13y ago
but being trapped in a city like LA or San Francisco with no access to the boundless natural beauty In SF, you can always to take the ferry to Marin.
vidarh 13y ago
The thing is you'd only be "trapped" with no access to the natural beauty because everyone opts for cars instead of public transport. Norway has a population density about 1/10th of the US (to get away from the "but the US is so big" argument that inevitably comes up), yet when I lived in Oslo, I could stroll along the main central city streets, and catch light rail to pretty much the middle of the woods in 20 minutes, regular rail to the central mountain massifs in a few hours, or a bus to the beach in 15 minutes. That only works because of heavy investment in public transport over decades, probably in part because car ownership became common much later - Norway wasn't particularly wealthy until the oil revenues started pouring in in the 70's. Culturally the car has never gotten the same position as in the US. Even households that have 2-3 cars will often rely on public transport for commutes. There'll always be areas where not having a car is impractical because of density - not everyone can sanely get away with not having a car in Norway either; and there's always be places that will be tricky to get to without a car - whether rented for the trip or your own. But the US is in the current situation because you've favoured the car for so long that everything is geared for it. Of course it's self-perpetuating. I've spent quite a lot of time in the Bay Area, without a drivers license (never bothered to learn to drive as I've never had any use for a car in Oslo and now London), and if I'd lived there I'd have gotten a license as quick as - I'm generally quite flexible about walking long distances just for the walk, and happy to take things easy and wait for a bus or a train , but even somewhere like the Bay Area with a population density well over the places I grew up had so horrible public transit coverage it'd drive me crazy.
- base698 13y ago
  The youth of today tend to focus way too much on the impracticalities and expense of driving. I have friends that live in SF and never drive anywhere, but they also don't like to do anything that isn't city related. Going to Yosemite or the middle of Utah on a whim would never cross their mind. Going on spontaneous road trips to places without public transit is something I do regularly. I'm not trying to solve the public policy problems--just pointing out that cars have immense practical value and aren't just metal coffins. When I went to Norway for vacation I was able to go to the wilderness on ferries like you suggest, which is great.

by base698 13y ago

fit2rule 13y ago

I'm not saying you shouldn't drive your car everywhere. I am saying, you shouldn't be doing it every day. That, right there, is one of the unhealthiest lifestyles, for everyone. The average American spends an hour a day in their car. This number changes over the years, of course, but generally Americans spend a large portion of their lives, consuming gas. Its just built into the nations life-lines at this point. Weekend trips with the car would be great! Alas, thats not how America uses its cars ..

josefresco 13y ago
Can you share the source for the data on how much time the average American spends in a car?
- ricardobeat 13y ago
  A quick google search points to an even higher average (101 minutes), in 2006: https://web.archive.org/web/20100526113417/http://www.revolutionhealth.com/blogs/drscherger/men-moderate-exercis-3815 https://web.archive.org/web/20100526113417/http://www.revolu...
reckoner13 13y ago
The thing is the infrastructure has been long established where the transition to more commuters using public transit is going to take a long time. In LA, they are putting in more public transit options, but the reality is most people commute too long of distances to their jobs for it to be practical to utilize it. So, these options will only be practical for a small population. Otherwise, your options are: 1) Drive an hour in traffic or 2) Spend 3+ hours on public transit (but in a cramped bus). What's your pick for the daily? This also limits your freedom (yep I said it.) to get groceries or do other errands with the little time you have after work which would add additional time to your commute. Are you American? Your perspective seems a little overgeneralized than reality. Don't get me wrong gas consumption is certainly an issue here. Hopefully Tesla drives the auto industry in the right direction.
justathrow2k 13y ago
One hour a day (on average) hardly seems like a LARGE portion of one's life. Surely, it adds up, but lets say you average being awake 15 hours a day, that's 1/15th of one's life. Not large in my opinion, and certainly no where close to being a majority. An aside...personally, I spend...8 minutes (or less ) in a car each day.

vellum 13y ago

but being trapped in a city like LA or San Francisco with no access to the boundless natural beauty In SF, you can always to take the ferry to Marin.

vidarh 13y ago

The thing is you'd only be "trapped" with no access to the natural beauty because everyone opts for cars instead of public transport. Norway has a population density about 1/10th of the US (to get away from the "but the US is so big" argument that inevitably comes up), yet when I lived in Oslo, I could stroll along the main central city streets, and catch light rail to pretty much the middle of the woods in 20 minutes, regular rail to the central mountain massifs in a few hours, or a bus to the beach in 15 minutes. That only works because of heavy investment in public transport over decades, probably in part because car ownership became common much later - Norway wasn't particularly wealthy until the oil revenues started pouring in in the 70's. Culturally the car has never gotten the same position as in the US. Even households that have 2-3 cars will often rely on public transport for commutes. There'll always be areas where not having a car is impractical because of density - not everyone can sanely get away with not having a car in Norway either; and there's always be places that will be tricky to get to without a car - whether rented for the trip or your own. But the US is in the current situation because you've favoured the car for so long that everything is geared for it. Of course it's self-perpetuating. I've spent quite a lot of time in the Bay Area, without a drivers license (never bothered to learn to drive as I've never had any use for a car in Oslo and now London), and if I'd lived there I'd have gotten a license as quick as - I'm generally quite flexible about walking long distances just for the walk, and happy to take things easy and wait for a bus or a train , but even somewhere like the Bay Area with a population density well over the places I grew up had so horrible public transit coverage it'd drive me crazy.

base698 13y ago
The youth of today tend to focus way too much on the impracticalities and expense of driving. I have friends that live in SF and never drive anywhere, but they also don't like to do anything that isn't city related. Going to Yosemite or the middle of Utah on a whim would never cross their mind. Going on spontaneous road trips to places without public transit is something I do regularly. I'm not trying to solve the public policy problems--just pointing out that cars have immense practical value and aren't just metal coffins. When I went to Norway for vacation I was able to go to the wilderness on ferries like you suggest, which is great.