4 ms·

It's a civil war because a lot of Ukrainians speaks Russian and want a "Russian" Ukraine.

by kome 13y ago

mtrimpe 13y ago
It's not so much about whether they speak Russian or not. Eastern Ukraine is just generally closer ideologically to Russia whereas Western Ukraine prefers to maintain close ties with Europe. You can see that reflected quite clearly in the split between west and east in where the protests are. In general the president is supported by the eastern part of Ukraine, but is also a convicted criminal who sent the previous president to jail on trumped up charges (which is what's blocking their entry into the EU.) FWIW, the linked presentation gives a pretty good overview of the dynamics at play at the moment... from the perspective of the protesters of course.
- piranha 13y ago
  > who sent the previous president to jail Not a previous president, but his political opponent.
- randomafrican 13y ago
  >who sent the previous president to jail on trumped up charges Previous Prime Minister. And I'm not 100% sure the charges are totally trumped up. Not that it changes anything.
  - yazmeya 13y ago
    Even if the charges aren't all trumped up, Tymoshenko was singled out for prosecution for her politics, without a doubt. With corruption as rampant as it is, there's a criminal case waiting to be made against practically anyone in a position of power in Ukraine.
  - dmytrish 13y ago
    Yes, Tymoshenko is not an angel by any means, but her conviction was clearly a political act to frighten other possible rivals with selective justice. Also, this was a great deal to gain some Putin's favor.
densh 13y ago
There is little connection if any between people speaking Russian and those wanting a "Russian" Ukraine. I come from russian-speaking part of Ukraine myself and hardly anyone here supports current government.
- IgorPartola 13y ago
  Seconded. Russian is my first language. I do not support this government.
free652 13y ago
Most Ukranians speak Russian due to eastern/southern parts larger than the western part. A lot of Ukranians speak "surjik" which is a mix between Russian and Ukranian and Western Ukranians speek a mix of Polish and Ukranian. I'd say there aren't many people that speak perfect Ukranian. Do you count people speaking "surjik" as Russian or Ukranian speakers? There is no civil war, if it was a civil war the western part wouldn't survive a day. Nor the Russian speaking Ukranians want "Russian" Ukraine.
dmytrish 13y ago
This is a very simplified point of view. The eastern part is mostly Russian-speaking but that does not mean all they want to speak Russian, it is just a convention there that slowly breaks up. Ethnic Russians are only 17% of the population and mostly live in Crimea and Donetsk/Lugansk oblasts. Most of people in Kharkov, Dnipropetrovsk, Odessa are still Ukrainians under heavy influence of Russian media and culture. "Russian Ukraine" is more of Crimea myth. People from all regions are ok with the existing Ukrainian state as far as they don't feel they are discriminated or demonized for other parts (it's a part of grudge between West Ukraine and Donetsk Ukraine, they often fault each other, Russia helps the latter much to do that, depicting evil Westerners as unbridled Nazi nationalists).

It's a civil war because a lot of Ukrainians speaks Russian and want a "Russian" Ukraine.

by kome 13y ago

It's a civil war because a lot of Ukrainians speaks Russian and want a "Russian" Ukraine.

It's not so much about whether they speak Russian or not. Eastern Ukraine is just generally closer ideologically to Russia whereas Western Ukraine prefers to maintain close ties with Europe. You can see that reflected quite clearly in the split between west and east in where the protests are. In general the president is supported by the eastern part of Ukraine, but is also a convicted criminal who sent the previous president to jail on trumped up charges (which is what's blocking their entry into the EU.) FWIW, the linked presentation gives a pretty good overview of the dynamics at play at the moment... from the perspective of the protesters of course.

piranha 13y ago
> who sent the previous president to jail Not a previous president, but his political opponent.
randomafrican 13y ago
>who sent the previous president to jail on trumped up charges Previous Prime Minister. And I'm not 100% sure the charges are totally trumped up. Not that it changes anything.
- yazmeya 13y ago
  Even if the charges aren't all trumped up, Tymoshenko was singled out for prosecution for her politics, without a doubt. With corruption as rampant as it is, there's a criminal case waiting to be made against practically anyone in a position of power in Ukraine.
- dmytrish 13y ago
  Yes, Tymoshenko is not an angel by any means, but her conviction was clearly a political act to frighten other possible rivals with selective justice. Also, this was a great deal to gain some Putin's favor.

densh 13y ago

There is little connection if any between people speaking Russian and those wanting a "Russian" Ukraine. I come from russian-speaking part of Ukraine myself and hardly anyone here supports current government.

IgorPartola 13y ago
Seconded. Russian is my first language. I do not support this government.

free652 13y ago

Most Ukranians speak Russian due to eastern/southern parts larger than the western part. A lot of Ukranians speak "surjik" which is a mix between Russian and Ukranian and Western Ukranians speek a mix of Polish and Ukranian. I'd say there aren't many people that speak perfect Ukranian. Do you count people speaking "surjik" as Russian or Ukranian speakers? There is no civil war, if it was a civil war the western part wouldn't survive a day. Nor the Russian speaking Ukranians want "Russian" Ukraine.

dmytrish 13y ago

This is a very simplified point of view. The eastern part is mostly Russian-speaking but that does not mean all they want to speak Russian, it is just a convention there that slowly breaks up. Ethnic Russians are only 17% of the population and mostly live in Crimea and Donetsk/Lugansk oblasts. Most of people in Kharkov, Dnipropetrovsk, Odessa are still Ukrainians under heavy influence of Russian media and culture. "Russian Ukraine" is more of Crimea myth. People from all regions are ok with the existing Ukrainian state as far as they don't feel they are discriminated or demonized for other parts (it's a part of grudge between West Ukraine and Donetsk Ukraine, they often fault each other, Russia helps the latter much to do that, depicting evil Westerners as unbridled Nazi nationalists).