3 ms·

end users do not give a shit about source code (or software licensing at all).

jfb 13y ago
It depends on who your end users are. They are not necessarily strictly consumers of software -- in fact, RMS' history clearly points to a concern for the rights of the interactive web of hackers circa the early 1970s. It is open for debate as to how relevant this focus is in today's very different looking software environment.
keithpeter 13y ago
Yup, I think that might be true. However, I also think (I don't know for certain) that is precisely why it is important that the FSF keeps plugging away and refusing to compromise. There has to be one place where people do give a shit. I have started to use gNewSense 3.0 recently. Small, fast, Gnome 2 and fortunately the er - maturity - of the packages does not affect my use cases.
wtetzner 13y ago
Depends on who the end users are. The end users of clang might care about source code.
frou_dh 13y ago
That's a pretty inane line of argument. Let's generalise it: Xs don't care about Y, except for those Xs that do. Insightful stuff.
TorKlingberg 13y ago
End users that don't want to modify the source code them selves still have the option to use a forked version made by somebody else.
Anderkent 13y ago
Well yes, that's the basis for Stallman's argument. If end users cared about free code, we wouldn't need to enforce it from the other side - nonfree software would have no users.
- Someone 13y ago
  I care about free oxygen for all, but if the only way to get it was by buying it, I would still buy it, and applaud those attempting to enforce it.
gillianseed 13y ago
Software developers are also end users. In fact I'd say this is one of the largest practical benefits for developers when it comes to GPL. If a developer releases their code under GPL and someone else improves upon it, they as end users will recieve the source code to those improvements with which they can improve their original code or simply adopt the improved version.
Nursie 13y ago
I'm an end user. You probably are too. As an end user the GPL benefits me by granting me access to the code, to make alterations, to republish as I see fit. Most end users don't care. Some do.

jfb 13y ago

It depends on who your end users are. They are not necessarily strictly consumers of software -- in fact, RMS' history clearly points to a concern for the rights of the interactive web of hackers circa the early 1970s. It is open for debate as to how relevant this focus is in today's very different looking software environment.

keithpeter 13y ago

Yup, I think that might be true. However, I also think (I don't know for certain) that is precisely why it is important that the FSF keeps plugging away and refusing to compromise. There has to be one place where people do give a shit. I have started to use gNewSense 3.0 recently. Small, fast, Gnome 2 and fortunately the er - maturity - of the packages does not affect my use cases.

wtetzner 13y ago

Depends on who the end users are. The end users of clang might care about source code.

frou_dh 13y ago

That's a pretty inane line of argument. Let's generalise it: Xs don't care about Y, except for those Xs that do. Insightful stuff.

TorKlingberg 13y ago

End users that don't want to modify the source code them selves still have the option to use a forked version made by somebody else.

Anderkent 13y ago

Well yes, that's the basis for Stallman's argument. If end users cared about free code, we wouldn't need to enforce it from the other side - nonfree software would have no users.

Someone 13y ago
I care about free oxygen for all, but if the only way to get it was by buying it, I would still buy it, and applaud those attempting to enforce it.

gillianseed 13y ago

Software developers are also end users. In fact I'd say this is one of the largest practical benefits for developers when it comes to GPL. If a developer releases their code under GPL and someone else improves upon it, they as end users will recieve the source code to those improvements with which they can improve their original code or simply adopt the improved version.

Nursie 13y ago

I'm an end user. You probably are too. As an end user the GPL benefits me by granting me access to the code, to make alterations, to republish as I see fit. Most end users don't care. Some do.