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They use miniature camera's in blind spots for the person using the machine, transparent foil on the numbers or even completely dummy covers on top of the real

They use miniature camera's in blind spots for the person using the machine, transparent foil on the numbers or even completely dummy covers on top of the real covers with prepaid phones sending the data immediately. My point is the bank can do so much more (and so easily) but they do not care. Your Credit Card act as a buffer if I understand correct. You can get the money back right? About my PIN? Yeah it doesn't work outside my country. In just 1.5 hours dive you can use that card abroad without the PIN. The banks have now blocked this by blocking the card abroad. So I need a Credit Card as well... My friend works for the biggest payment system we have around here. They do not care about these systems as they're focusing on a society without PIN/Credit Cards. Cool of course, but for now we're stuck in 1980.

darklajid 13y ago
It seems (correct me if I'm wrong) you're assuming I'm not from Europe/not using DirectDebit. If that's the case: Both isn't true - I own a CC for roundabout 3 (4?) years, but don't trust it/don't use it a lot. That said: I see a weird trend over here as well - it seems stores are regularly switching between the card&pin method and the braindead 'just sign here' way of things. So my card can probably be abused, albeit not online and not at any ATM. I don't think we disagree a lot: There are still huge gaping holes that aren't hard to exploit. But that's still no reason _not_ to use the card&pin system (-> see article). We shouldn't stop there and wear a smug face, 'Europe is secure, we are done'. But in the light of this article we're still better off.
- digitalengineer 13y ago
  You're right. But are we better off? Stolen money from Creit Cards is refunded if I'm correct. Stolen money from my Debit card is not refunded. I am to blame...
bowlofpetunias 13y ago
Wait, what? What Debit Card do you use that works without PIN?
- dagw 13y ago
  Not all places have chip+pin terminals. All debit cards I've used (in Sweden) let you swipe and sign a receipt in place of typing your PIN.
  - digitalengineer 13y ago
    Yes, that's what happened to me as well (vacation in France, some time ago). I was shocked. There was no protection if I lost my card.
- EiZei 13y ago
  They do but usually it's the fallback option which means the merchant is more liable and is supposed to check your ID as well.

darklajid 13y ago

It seems (correct me if I'm wrong) you're assuming I'm not from Europe/not using DirectDebit. If that's the case: Both isn't true - I own a CC for roundabout 3 (4?) years, but don't trust it/don't use it a lot. That said: I see a weird trend over here as well - it seems stores are regularly switching between the card&pin method and the braindead 'just sign here' way of things. So my card can probably be abused, albeit not online and not at any ATM. I don't think we disagree a lot: There are still huge gaping holes that aren't hard to exploit. But that's still no reason _not_ to use the card&pin system (-> see article). We shouldn't stop there and wear a smug face, 'Europe is secure, we are done'. But in the light of this article we're still better off.

digitalengineer 13y ago
You're right. But are we better off? Stolen money from Creit Cards is refunded if I'm correct. Stolen money from my Debit card is not refunded. I am to blame...

bowlofpetunias 13y ago

Wait, what? What Debit Card do you use that works without PIN?

dagw 13y ago
Not all places have chip+pin terminals. All debit cards I've used (in Sweden) let you swipe and sign a receipt in place of typing your PIN.
- digitalengineer 13y ago
  Yes, that's what happened to me as well (vacation in France, some time ago). I was shocked. There was no protection if I lost my card.
EiZei 13y ago
They do but usually it's the fallback option which means the merchant is more liable and is supposed to check your ID as well.