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An over current situation would trip the branch. A grounding issue would trip the main switch. If water came into the electric circuit causing a grounding of th

An over current situation would trip the branch. A grounding issue would trip the main switch. If water came into the electric circuit causing a grounding of the current, then the main switch would trip. Nothing wrong with the house wiring.

ars 13y ago
> A grounding issue would trip the main switch. If water came into the electric circuit causing a grounding of the current, then the main switch would trip. No it wouldn't. You could stick the bare wires of a branch circuit in water and it wouldn't trip the main breaker. The main breaker will trip if there is a short inside the panel (which is all but impossible unless you are working on it live - which is sometimes done). Or if you used so much electricity you simply overloaded it, but if you did that you have the wrong panel for your house (or you are running some crazy equipment - arc furnace, maybe).
- DaveLond 13y ago
  Errr, short-circuiting to ground will cause a RCD to trip immediately - that's what they're there for. You will generally have one RCD on the entire fuse board, and then individual circuit breakers for each branch.
  - ars 13y ago
    If that's really how they do that - one RCD for a bunch of circuits then I have to retract my words, a ground fault would cause a whole bunch of circuits to lose power. It seems crazy to me, but if they do that, then they do that.
- Robin_Message 13y ago
  Main breakers in the UK are often RCDs, which do in fact trip in the case of grounding issues. The main breaker usually feeds into several circuit breakers. Generally the wiring goes: mains input -> 1 or more RCDs -> several circuit breakers -> several outlets -> fuse in plug -> appliance. So a grounding fault can take out many circuits, and many-lots of sockets.
  - ars 13y ago
    OK, that's new to me. They really do that? One RCD for several breakers? How is the panel wired - how do you pick which breakers are on which RCD? That must cause so many nuisance trips - doesn't seem like a good idea (kinda like the ring circuit that to this day causes trouble). In the US you can have an RCD (called a GFCI here) in the panel, but it feeds a single branch.
    - alextingle 13y ago
      The regs in the UK say that (pretty much) every circuit must be RCD protected. But they also say that you can't use a single RCD to protect everything, because you might need power to fix whatever has tripped the RCD. RCDs are expensive, so the most common solution is to have two RCDs, each protecting half of the circuits.
    - Robin_Message 13y ago
      I'm only going on our panel, which is perhaps slightly non-standard due to another UK electricity quirk [1], but was done by an electrician last year so is up to regulations at least. It has a split in the bus, so there are two RCDs, one on the left with a couple of breakers and one on the right with the rest of the breakers, and a separator in the middle. Like: supply in -> R-B-B | B-B-B-B-B-R <- supply in C R R | R-R R R R C neutral -> D-K-K | K-K-K-K-K-D <- neutral [1] The quirk of our board is that the left hand breaker is driven by a separate supply cable from the meter, which is only turned on between midnight and 7am. In this way, we get cheaper electricity at night which is used for storage heaters and immersion water heater. However, we no longer have the storage heaters, so it doesn't really make sense. This set up is called Economy 7 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_7 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_7). Also, @alextingle, I didn't know that you were meant to have two separate circuits, although that makes sense. Lots of things are required to be RCD protected in the UK, so as you say, it makes sense just to put everything behind an RCD. We don't get any nuisance trips, which I attribute to a generally higher standard of wiring, earthing etc. in the UK, although that could just be jingoism :) (I did once live in the US and some of the literally fraying wiring connected to two pin sockets with no earthing in the house I lived in scared me.)
- icebraining 13y ago
  but if you did that you have the wrong panel for your house Wrong is relative: here in Portugal we pay a fixed monthly fee that is proportional to the maximum load. Having the "right" panel may cost you more even if you use less electricity, so many people choose to carefully manage their loads instead.
- deleted 13y ago
  [deleted]
hessenwolf 13y ago
Feel free to expand...

ars 13y ago

> A grounding issue would trip the main switch. If water came into the electric circuit causing a grounding of the current, then the main switch would trip. No it wouldn't. You could stick the bare wires of a branch circuit in water and it wouldn't trip the main breaker. The main breaker will trip if there is a short inside the panel (which is all but impossible unless you are working on it live - which is sometimes done). Or if you used so much electricity you simply overloaded it, but if you did that you have the wrong panel for your house (or you are running some crazy equipment - arc furnace, maybe).

DaveLond 13y ago
Errr, short-circuiting to ground will cause a RCD to trip immediately - that's what they're there for. You will generally have one RCD on the entire fuse board, and then individual circuit breakers for each branch.
- ars 13y ago
  If that's really how they do that - one RCD for a bunch of circuits then I have to retract my words, a ground fault would cause a whole bunch of circuits to lose power. It seems crazy to me, but if they do that, then they do that.
Robin_Message 13y ago
Main breakers in the UK are often RCDs, which do in fact trip in the case of grounding issues. The main breaker usually feeds into several circuit breakers. Generally the wiring goes: mains input -> 1 or more RCDs -> several circuit breakers -> several outlets -> fuse in plug -> appliance. So a grounding fault can take out many circuits, and many-lots of sockets.
- ars 13y ago
  OK, that's new to me. They really do that? One RCD for several breakers? How is the panel wired - how do you pick which breakers are on which RCD? That must cause so many nuisance trips - doesn't seem like a good idea (kinda like the ring circuit that to this day causes trouble). In the US you can have an RCD (called a GFCI here) in the panel, but it feeds a single branch.
  - alextingle 13y ago
    The regs in the UK say that (pretty much) every circuit must be RCD protected. But they also say that you can't use a single RCD to protect everything, because you might need power to fix whatever has tripped the RCD. RCDs are expensive, so the most common solution is to have two RCDs, each protecting half of the circuits.
  - Robin_Message 13y ago
    I'm only going on our panel, which is perhaps slightly non-standard due to another UK electricity quirk [1], but was done by an electrician last year so is up to regulations at least. It has a split in the bus, so there are two RCDs, one on the left with a couple of breakers and one on the right with the rest of the breakers, and a separator in the middle. Like: supply in -> R-B-B | B-B-B-B-B-R <- supply in C R R | R-R R R R C neutral -> D-K-K | K-K-K-K-K-D <- neutral [1] The quirk of our board is that the left hand breaker is driven by a separate supply cable from the meter, which is only turned on between midnight and 7am. In this way, we get cheaper electricity at night which is used for storage heaters and immersion water heater. However, we no longer have the storage heaters, so it doesn't really make sense. This set up is called Economy 7 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_7 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_7). Also, @alextingle, I didn't know that you were meant to have two separate circuits, although that makes sense. Lots of things are required to be RCD protected in the UK, so as you say, it makes sense just to put everything behind an RCD. We don't get any nuisance trips, which I attribute to a generally higher standard of wiring, earthing etc. in the UK, although that could just be jingoism :) (I did once live in the US and some of the literally fraying wiring connected to two pin sockets with no earthing in the house I lived in scared me.)
icebraining 13y ago
but if you did that you have the wrong panel for your house Wrong is relative: here in Portugal we pay a fixed monthly fee that is proportional to the maximum load. Having the "right" panel may cost you more even if you use less electricity, so many people choose to carefully manage their loads instead.
deleted 13y ago
[deleted]

hessenwolf 13y ago

Feel free to expand...