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In fairness, are you sure they should be parking there if it's not a loading zone? I once was stuck behind a truck that refused to move on a one-lane street for

In fairness, are you sure they should be parking there if it's not a loading zone? I once was stuck behind a truck that refused to move on a one-lane street for 20 minutes while he insisted on unloading, backing up traffic 3 blocks down the street.

to3m 13y ago
I rather agree. When my daily commute involved driving through the city centre, it certainly seemed like the general public would be best served by not having things left parked where they shouldn't be! It was a rare day that didn't involve sitting in traffic for 5-10 minutes waiting for a rudely-parked van or lorry to be unloaded.
greenyoda 13y ago
In midtown NYC, there are lots of narrow streets that have small businesses lining both sides of the street and cars parked on both sides of the street. The only way to deliver anything to these businesses would be to double park the truck. Making double parking illegal there is essentially outlawing commerce on these streets.
- talmand 13y ago
  That sounds like something that the businesses of that street should be addressing with the local government to get that obvious problem resolved. Such as a loading zone that doesn't allow general parking during certain hours. Yes, it's not optimal but it's better than the ticket and causing traffic problems.
  - greenyoda 13y ago
    The local government has no interest in fixing it since the parking tickets are a cash cow for the city. The fines are ultimately paid by the people who have to pay more for the goods these businesses are selling to cover the cost of business. Unfortunately, this is just one of the many things that makes businesses in NYC less cost-competitive.
    - _delirium 13y ago
      The "free street parking is my god-given right" lobby in NYC is an equally big issue. As far as I'm aware, it's the only city of its level of density in the Western world that has free street parking in the urban core, producing super weird dynamics for a limited resource priced way below market value. You could improve a lot of things by: 1) charging something closer to market value for parking; and 2) removing at least some of the parking entirely, turning the space currently occupied by rusting stationary metal (which is rarely moved b/c people fear losing their parking space!) over to more useful purposes such as loading/unloading zones, bike lanes, hell even some wider sidewalks and linear parks.
  - stinkytaco 13y ago
    Yes, they should address it with local government and I'm sure they do. However, that's not a perfectly effecient system either. There's often one or two vocal citizens that can obstruct the process for small businesses. Just to be clear, I don't feel governments should favor small businesses over residential or vice versa, but just that complaining to local government means getting politics involved. The other issue is that perhaps the businesses want the parking for customers. Seems silly to cut off a bunch of parking for 20 minutes of deliveries in a day as well. Lots of cities were just not designed with the modern world in mind and these industries grow out of the problems.
    - deleted 13y ago
      [deleted]
  - drak0n1c 13y ago
    In Tokyo, trucks are only allowed to unload during the nighttime. The Japanese attitude toward government regulation (and staying up late for social obligations, etc) is quite different, for better or for worse.
    - Zigurd 13y ago
      I observed the same thing in Beijing. Daytime deliveries are handled by motor-trikes with a small flatbed on the back. Delivery trucks do not block streets in the daytime and appear to be largely, maybe completely banned during daytime.
- eli 13y ago
  I get what you're saying, but double parking is already illegal on those streets no matter how aggressively its enforced. Midtown has commercial parking zones (with their very own meters!). I would imagine the "right" thing to do is park there and "carry" load your goods on a handtruck or similar.
- qq66 13y ago
  San Francisco's solution is to allow short-term double parking for commercial deliveries. It's less infuriating to other drivers when it's explicitly legal.
talmand 13y ago
I would have to assume it was not a loading zone, if it were I find it doubtful they would be ticketed. I guess it depends on local ordinance, but from what I'm hearing this sounds like a justified ticket.
pkulak 13y ago
I think transport trucks have first right to streets (after emergency vehicles, of course). They pay a lot of taxes and it's the only way to get good delivered in cities. If commuters don't like waiting, they can always take transit or ride a bike.
- ceejayoz 13y ago
  Citizens pay a pretty decent amount in taxes too.

to3m 13y ago

I rather agree. When my daily commute involved driving through the city centre, it certainly seemed like the general public would be best served by not having things left parked where they shouldn't be! It was a rare day that didn't involve sitting in traffic for 5-10 minutes waiting for a rudely-parked van or lorry to be unloaded.

greenyoda 13y ago

In midtown NYC, there are lots of narrow streets that have small businesses lining both sides of the street and cars parked on both sides of the street. The only way to deliver anything to these businesses would be to double park the truck. Making double parking illegal there is essentially outlawing commerce on these streets.

talmand 13y ago
That sounds like something that the businesses of that street should be addressing with the local government to get that obvious problem resolved. Such as a loading zone that doesn't allow general parking during certain hours. Yes, it's not optimal but it's better than the ticket and causing traffic problems.
- greenyoda 13y ago
  The local government has no interest in fixing it since the parking tickets are a cash cow for the city. The fines are ultimately paid by the people who have to pay more for the goods these businesses are selling to cover the cost of business. Unfortunately, this is just one of the many things that makes businesses in NYC less cost-competitive.
  - _delirium 13y ago
    The "free street parking is my god-given right" lobby in NYC is an equally big issue. As far as I'm aware, it's the only city of its level of density in the Western world that has free street parking in the urban core, producing super weird dynamics for a limited resource priced way below market value. You could improve a lot of things by: 1) charging something closer to market value for parking; and 2) removing at least some of the parking entirely, turning the space currently occupied by rusting stationary metal (which is rarely moved b/c people fear losing their parking space!) over to more useful purposes such as loading/unloading zones, bike lanes, hell even some wider sidewalks and linear parks.
- stinkytaco 13y ago
  Yes, they should address it with local government and I'm sure they do. However, that's not a perfectly effecient system either. There's often one or two vocal citizens that can obstruct the process for small businesses. Just to be clear, I don't feel governments should favor small businesses over residential or vice versa, but just that complaining to local government means getting politics involved. The other issue is that perhaps the businesses want the parking for customers. Seems silly to cut off a bunch of parking for 20 minutes of deliveries in a day as well. Lots of cities were just not designed with the modern world in mind and these industries grow out of the problems.
  - deleted 13y ago
    [deleted]
- drak0n1c 13y ago
  In Tokyo, trucks are only allowed to unload during the nighttime. The Japanese attitude toward government regulation (and staying up late for social obligations, etc) is quite different, for better or for worse.
  - Zigurd 13y ago
    I observed the same thing in Beijing. Daytime deliveries are handled by motor-trikes with a small flatbed on the back. Delivery trucks do not block streets in the daytime and appear to be largely, maybe completely banned during daytime.
eli 13y ago
I get what you're saying, but double parking is already illegal on those streets no matter how aggressively its enforced. Midtown has commercial parking zones (with their very own meters!). I would imagine the "right" thing to do is park there and "carry" load your goods on a handtruck or similar.
qq66 13y ago
San Francisco's solution is to allow short-term double parking for commercial deliveries. It's less infuriating to other drivers when it's explicitly legal.

talmand 13y ago

I would have to assume it was not a loading zone, if it were I find it doubtful they would be ticketed. I guess it depends on local ordinance, but from what I'm hearing this sounds like a justified ticket.

pkulak 13y ago

I think transport trucks have first right to streets (after emergency vehicles, of course). They pay a lot of taxes and it's the only way to get good delivered in cities. If commuters don't like waiting, they can always take transit or ride a bike.

ceejayoz 13y ago
Citizens pay a pretty decent amount in taxes too.